KS initial impressions

[Kit Craft]

I did not hear suggestions the last lot that hit the dealers were NOS.
These were definitely new knives, recently made. Not NOS for sure.
There are several floating around the forums. 2 on KKF yesterday at correct, not inflated, prices.

It was stated that they were 'likely' NOS on the other forum in the big KS thread when Mark first announced that he was getting some here. But from the reaction to the 'different' grind people seemed to just blow that off. I would not know one way or the other.

[Barashka]

Anyone know where I can get a NiB KS other than from the Hacho site? Their price seems a little steep, even if it comes with a Masamoto saya (which I'm not totally sure it does).

... You might find someone who has buyers remorse or simply wanted to check the knife out in person and didn't like it. Rather, they may be NIB or very slightly used. ...

I might be in that boat ... great knife but I'm struggling to really like it as much as people seem to think I should be.
Do you want it to try as well? or you know you want one?

[Lepus]

I might be in that boat ... great knife but I'm struggling to really like it as much as people seem to think I should be.
Do you want it to try as well? or you know you want one?

I'm surprised so many people seem to be finding the KS to match their expectations. The older one I tried was a great and cohesive knife, but it had a few quirks that I don't think most people would like and they're pretty costly for what you get.

[mauichef]

It did not speak to me that’s for sure.
I almost felt like I was missing something.
But that is not to say its a bad knife in any respect. But it was not enjoyable to me at all.

[Cutuu]

If i were to close my eyes and hold the ks, i imagine it would feel as nice as any knive could. But i can easily see why people could be like meh, especially for a home user. I love mine and can see why it has a cult following. But for $100 bucks less u could get a kashima that's a beast of a utility gyuto. A little dainter, but flows through product with an ease that makes up for it.

[Kit Craft]

Yeah, I totally get that this is not the right knife for most and I think as I said on the first page, that I would recommend something like my Kono HD2 to 9/10 people and the KS to that one special person. I just happen to resonate with the knife myself, which is weird because I use mostly 180mm gyutos....I guess it might be the long and narrow slicer like feel that the knife has and my almost 99% use of G&G.

The knife and its quirks are what I think makes it special to so many and particular a lot of pros that seem to love the knife. It is a big knife that feels small. It takes a great edge, holds it fairly well and touches up ever so easily. It does nothing perfectly and everything well. It is not a laser yet it is not even a middleweight. The knife can take a hell of a beating, I assure you.

It is an oddball like me and we weirdos have to stick together.

[Unsharp]

I might be in that boat ... great knife but I'm struggling to really like it as much as people seem to think I should be.
Do you want it to try as well? or you know you want one?

That's a really nice gesture. I will pass though, thank you. I'm feel too green to borrow someone's knife or to know really how to gauge it from experience.

Kit's last post about the HD2 might keep me satisfied. I'm a modest home cook with a kono laser white #2 and an HD2 kept unused. I really like the flat profile on the new MM's, so I might head in that direction next.

[Kit Craft]

I might be in that boat ... great knife but I'm struggling to really like it as much as people seem to think I should be.
Do you want it to try as well? or you know you want one?

That's a really nice gesture. I will pass though, thank you. I'm feel too green to borrow someone's knife or to know really how to gauge it from experience.

Kit's last post about the HD2 might keep me satisfied. I'm a modest home cook with a kono laser white #2 and an HD2 kept unused. I really like the flat profile on the new MM's, so I might head in that direction next.

Oh, I like the idea of an MM. Let us know how you like it if you go that way!

[Barashka]

I might be in that boat ... great knife but I'm struggling to really like it as much as people seem to think I should be.
Do you want it to try as well? or you know you want one?

I'm surprised so many people seem to be finding the KS to match their expectations. The older one I tried was a great and cohesive knife, but it had a few quirks that I don't think most people would like and they're pretty costly for what you get.

It's a great knife, truly is, but I find myself wanting to reach for my kramer more, maybe I just like tall knives in general .. maybe I just have too many (is that even possible!?).

[Kit Craft]

It's a great knife, truly is, but I find myself wanting to reach for my kramer more, maybe I just like tall knives in general .. maybe I just have too many (is that even possible!?).

Kramer or ZKramer? Carbon, stainless or stainless damascus? 8 inch or 10 inch? ...I have been thinking about picking one up out of curiosity. I recently found out there is an SLT not too far from here, never knew, and I can check out at least the stainless version before actually committing.

I love my KS but after having it awhile now I do not ALWAYS pick that knife up. I still do not own a knife that my hand gravitates toward. Some days it is the KS others it is the HD2 others still it is the Yuki, the Tojiro, the FKH, a Tanaka, a Miyabi etc...lol. I am so indecisive...Sometimes I sit there and stare at my knives trying to figure out which one to use! Though, my old stand by is the Tojiro santoku. Can't decide then that is what I pick up. It is a brainless act because I know I can beat the tar out of it and have on many an occasion.

Oh and back to the point of the KS itself, general comment here. I have been working on my rocking, which I admit is still lacking but an improvement, and I find that I might have judged her a little harshly in this regard but not by a lot. She does rock better than I had initially thought but still not as good as my Yuki, for example. The better I get the more that Yuki seems to walk by itself. The KS needs a little direction.

[salemj]

Kit, you’re not the only one. Just last night I had a ripe tomato to cut and I nearly used my new honyaki. Instead I decided to hold off until I look some pictures and picked up my Kono Ginsan. Wooeee. I forgot how much that knife loves my recent Aoto. Simply devine. Point is, I don’t think I’ve used the knife since I sharpened it a couple months ago. Other options in closer reach, I guess! Variety is sometimes the spice of life.

[Kit Craft]

Kit, you’re not the only one. Just last night I had a ripe tomato to cut and I nearly used my new honyaki. Instead I decided to hold off until I look some pictures and picked up my Kono Ginsan. Wooeee. I forgot how much that knife loves my recent Aoto. Simply devine. Point is, I don’t think I’ve used the knife since I sharpened it a couple months ago. Other options in closer reach, I guess! Variety is sometimes the spice of life.

Absolutely. Sometimes I like to break out all of my knives that I keep but don't have in rotation (about a dozen at any given time) and work on the scraps in the chicken/compost bowl I keep on my prep table. My wife always asks, why are you cutting up potato skins...

[Barashka]

It's a great knife, truly is, but I find myself wanting to reach for my kramer more, maybe I just like tall knives in general .. maybe I just have too many (is that even possible!?).

...Sometimes I sit there and stare at my knives trying to figure out which one to use! ...

Absolutely I do that too! My choices are a little more limited then what you listed, but getting there

Kramer or ZKramer? Carbon, stainless or stainless damascus? 8 inch or 10 inch?

I have Kramer Meiji 8" ... though I sometimes wish I went for the 10".
The new Kramers have a western handle, I was looking specifically for d shape. though I hear new ones are very comfy too. I hear damascus kramers are a little sticky.
I really like mine, it's also a truly great knife (especially if you get it on sale). Stays sharp longer then I thought it would, new ones use better steel so should stay shaper even longer. Fit and finish are excellent. Striking to look at. Heavy in hand though, depends if you like that. Profile is good for all around, it has a bit off a flat and a bit of a curve at the end, however, I personally wish I had more of a flat spot, hence wondering about 10". It's quite tall as well, which I really come to like. I can never give up the tapered bolster/handle ... most comfy handle for pinch grip I've ever tried.
Do go to SLT and try to hold it, they'll probably give you a carrot or something to try it on, but that's no real indication of how it'll feel after some potatoes etc. SLT has pretty great return policy too (probably why they charge a premium on everything).

[Kit Craft]

It's a great knife, truly is, but I find myself wanting to reach for my kramer more, maybe I just like tall knives in general .. maybe I just have too many (is that even possible!?).

...Sometimes I sit there and stare at my knives trying to figure out which one to use! ...

Absolutely I do that too! My choices are a little more limited then what you listed, but getting there

Kramer or ZKramer? Carbon, stainless or stainless damascus? 8 inch or 10 inch?

I have Kramer Meiji 8" ... though I sometimes wish I went for the 10".
The new Kramers have a western handle, I was looking specifically for d shape. though I hear new ones are very comfy too. I hear damascus kramers are a little sticky.
I really like mine, it's also a truly great knife (especially if you get it on sale). Stays sharp longer then I thought it would, new ones use better steel so should stay shaper even longer. Fit and finish are excellent. Striking to look at. Heavy in hand though, depends if you like that. Profile is good for all around, it has a bit off a flat and a bit of a curve at the end, however, I personally wish I had more of a flat spot, hence wondering about 10". It's quite tall as well, which I really come to like. I can never give up the tapered bolster/handle ... most comfy handle for pinch grip I've ever tried.
Do go to SLT and try to hold it, they'll probably give you a carrot or something to try it on, but that's no real indication of how it'll feel after some potatoes etc. SLT has pretty great return policy too (probably why they charge a premium on everything).

I forgot about that one. Hum, I like D handles.

Thanks for the input!

[Lepus]

You might like that it is taller, or heavier, or that is has a more dynamic profile that makes rocking or push cutting more authoritative. How gradual a knife's belly is will change how abruptly the heel hits the board and how tall the tip is will impact how high the knife can rock. For some knives like the KS it is easy to start a push cut with the tip and then glide in all the way to the heel; knives with more abrupt belly and taller tips start push cuts at different points and feel different.

I actually really love the KS profile, but not everyone does or should. I would not be without my Shibata.

[Barashka]

...I actually really love the KS profile, but not everyone does or should. I would not be without my Shibata.

There are things I already really like with the KS, I'll give it more time, it's more knife than I ever really need, so it might be that I'm just not seeing it all yet.
On Shibata note, how do you like it? Do you have the KS profile one or Ktip gyuto? (I was choosing between the KS and ktip Shibata at the time).

[Cutuu]

@barashka, i believe lepus has the kashima.
@joe, the kono ginsan is probably my favorite house knive. I pick it up to make a huge meal or just cut one or two things. It gets a lot of slack for its low height, but i just love that knive for the house. Ive retired it from a pro environment. Ive come to terms its s house cat for me.

[Lepus]

I have the Kashima, the KS profile version. I love it. Since I bought it it is my most used knife by a wide margin. Unlike the KS which has a thin tip and a little meat at the heel, the Kashima is thin throughout, though it does have some convexing. The profile is a close match. The Kashima's balance is a bit further back because of the heavier handle and lower weight.

It, the Akifusa SRS-15, and the Shiro Kamo R2 are the best knives I've used for pro kitchens. They hold an edge, they move through anything with gusto, and they stand up to some abuse.

[Kit Craft]

So some updates here. Also, for you other fellas with more experience, please chime in and let me know if this does not quite fit! I sure wish Steven (JSG) was around for this particular conversation.

This knife takes a pretty mild to dull patina. White # 2 normally does but this knife seems even less reactive. When I do a touch up on my Ginga, I get little black/grey lines in my onions for two-three onions, even off of a strop. Not so much with the KS unless I actually take it to the stone and remove steel from the entire bevel. (I normally keep up with my one sided micro bevel for a few weeks.)

Edge retention is still impressive compared to what others had lead me to believe. It does not have as good retention as my Yuki but much better than my Ginga and Kono in the same steel. I mean an extra 3-5 meal preps depending on the prep itself. I think at home that is meaningful, maybe not so much in the workplace.

So as for the edge. I have experimented with a mid grit finish in the shapton pro 2k, and I do not love that edge for this knife. It is too aggressive for me on everything except butchery and I have other knives for that. Moving up to a 3-5k is a big improvement, imo, as an all round edge. Chosera 3k, rika5k and or SS 5k. I like the SS 5k edge a lot on many knives in general but I am still new to that stone so I will spare you. I have also tried out some mid grit natural edges and of them I like Aizu the best but Aono is nice too. But again for this particular HT I find those a bit more aggressive than I like.

Okay then, lets talk finishing stones. I think this knife really likes a Kitayama finish, full polish. It does great with a Arashiyama finish too and even an SP8K finish. But I think it shines with a Kitayama + Takashima finish. However, I find that to restore the bite that I like I have to touch up with both stones in tandem, every time. This requires more time and work. If pushed for time I would skip the Taka.

Conclusion, though I like a 3-5k finish in general I like taking this one all the way, for whatever reason. Maybe that is just me growing as a sharpener or as a knife user, I don't know. Take it for what it is worth to you.

One thing about this knife that I would like to point out, again, is that it really is like three knives. That front 1/3 is a laser, the middle is a light middle-weight and the rear is a middleweight with some workhorse qualities for sure. Yes, most if not all of my knives act like this but not to this extent. I don't know if that is the grind itself or the size of the knife or a bit of both that makes it seem so noticeable. Or again, my adapting to the knife and or growing skill wise. Even if ever so slightly.

It really is weird for me to comment like this. This is the thought process I use before making a review. This time around the review is almost a living thing...lol. Anyway, more commentary is always welcomed.

[gladius]

This knife takes a pretty mild to dull patina. White # 2 normally does but this knife seems even less reactive. When I do a touch up on my Ginga, I get little black/grey lines in my onions for two-three onions, even off of a strop. Not so much with the KS unless I actually take it to the stone and remove steel from the entire bevel. (I normally keep up with my one sided micro bevel for a few weeks.)

This is true with the Masamoto carbons I have owned.

Edge retention is still impressive compared to what others had lead me to believe. It does not have as good retention as my Yuki but much better than my Ginga and Kono in the same steel. I mean an extra 3-5 meal preps depending on the prep itself. I think at home that is meaningful, maybe not so much in the workplace.

Again also true with the Masamoto carbons

So as for the edge. I have experimented with a mid grit finish in the shapton pro 2k, and I do not love that edge for this knife. It is too aggressive for me on everything except butchery and I have other knives for that. Moving up to a 3-5k is a big improvement, imo, as an all round edge. Chosera 3k, rika5k and or SS 5k. I like the SS 5k edge a lot on many knives in general but I am still new to that stone so I will spare you. I have also tried out some mid grit natural edges and of them I like Aizu the best but Aono is nice too. But again for this particular HT I find those a bit more aggressive than I like.

Okay then, lets talk finishing stones. I think this knife really likes a Kitayama finish, full polish. It does great with a Arashiyama finish too and even an SP8K finish. But I think it shines with a Kitayama + Takashima finish. However, I find that to restore the bite that I like I have to touch up with both stones in tandem, every time. This requires more time and work. If pushed for time I would skip the Taka.

Conclusion, though I like a 3-5k finish in general I like taking this one all the way, for whatever reason. Maybe that is just me growing as a sharpener or as a knife user, I don't know. Take it for what it is worth to you.

Have you tried a Belgian Blue stone? It works well in the ~4k range: follow the 5k synthetic edge with the BB/coticule bout for a nice combination polished edge with bite. The BB also is a good touch up stone for the KS and other knives that doesn't remove allot of metal and that edge is fantastic.