Opps Chosera 800 !

old onion
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Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Sun Feb 25, 2018 12:59 pm

This is short and sweet. I bought Naniwa Professional 400,800 and 3000 grit Chosera stones not to very long ago.Just took out the Chosera 800 to use for about the third time and sure enough,I noticed small hairline cracks all through the top layer of the stone that I have been sharpening on.Will they affect sharpening at a later date? Only time will tell.My fault,I guess,because many have reported such cracks but I took a chance anyways.$73 bucks for such a stone does not make this a good stone in my book.As said,I have only used this stone maybe three times at the most and each time I wrapped a damp microfiber towel around it and put it on my wire rack,on it's side to dry in a cool,well ventilated area without temperature changes.I guess,with Chosera,you pays your money and take your chances.My 400 and 3000 grit haven't showed the cracking signs yet, but......

gladius
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by gladius » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:40 pm

Chosera stones are very good but a few do show hairline spider cracks but do NOT affect performance. My 800, 2000, 4000 and Snow White have all exhibited those...Do NOT wrap in any thing, just let them air dry.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:50 pm

gladius wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 1:40 pm
Chosera stones are very good but a few do show hairline spider cracks but do NOT affect performance. My 800, 2000, 4000 and Snow White have all exhibited those...Do NOT wrap in any thing, just let them air dry.
Thanks,I'll take your advice about wrapping in a damp towel.I also might add that I never soaked the stones even though some say that they perform better when done so for a few minutes.I found just a few squirts with the spray water bottle allows the water to lay on top.No need to soak.

Lepus
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by Lepus » Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:35 pm

My 3k showed a few cracks for a while. I think I've lapped past it. No worried on my 400, 1000, or Snow White.

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Jeff B
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by Jeff B » Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:03 pm

Have the 400,1k,3k and Snow White and none of mine have cracked/spider webbed. They are the old Chocera and not the newer Pro line.
If God wanted me to be a vegetarian he wouldn't have made animals taste so good.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:12 am

Jeff B wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:03 pm
Have the 400,1k,3k and Snow White and none of mine have cracked/spider webbed. They are the old Chocera and not the newer Pro line.
I wonder if there is a different formula with the base stones as compared to the non base or if the base alone prevents the spider web cracking.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:17 am

Lepus wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 7:35 pm
My 3k showed a few cracks for a while. I think I've lapped past it. No worried on my 400, 1000, or Snow White.
Mine could just very well be a surface issue going on.I lapped mine lightly but they still show some signs after drying.My Snow White hasn't showed any signs at all and I have had it longer then these Choseras.

Lepus
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by Lepus » Mon Feb 26, 2018 11:49 am

I went in pretty heavily once to see if I could work past the cracks. They did show up after I left the stone damp in transit, so I think it is just a binder issue.

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Kit Craft
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by Kit Craft » Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:30 pm

Mine never had any cracks or spider web things. I had the 400, 800, 2000, and 3000. I still have the 3k and the snow white, no issues. None with base. I do/did use mine as splash and go 100%. Not even a 3 second dip in the pond. A squirt of water on top and that is that.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Mon Feb 26, 2018 5:46 pm

Kit Craft wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:30 pm
Mine never had any cracks or spider web things. I had the 400, 800, 2000, and 3000. I still have the 3k and the snow white, no issues. None with base. I do/did use mine as splash and go 100%. Not even a 3 second dip in the pond. A squirt of water on top and that is that.
Maybe my stones were made on either a Monday or Friday then. ;)

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Jeff B
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by Jeff B » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:24 pm

old onion wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:12 am
Jeff B wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:03 pm
Have the 400,1k,3k and Snow White and none of mine have cracked/spider webbed. They are the old Chocera and not the newer Pro line.
I wonder if there is a different formula with the base stones as compared to the non base or if the base alone prevents the spider web cracking.
I bought the ones without bases but they are the old Choceras and not the Pros. I did hear a few complaints back then about cracking but it mostly occurred with people that had soaked their stones.
If God wanted me to be a vegetarian he wouldn't have made animals taste so good.

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Kit Craft
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by Kit Craft » Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:53 pm

I have had the same experience and heard the same things as Jeff. However, mine are the pros.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Tue Feb 27, 2018 2:03 am

Jeff B wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:24 pm
old onion wrote:
Mon Feb 26, 2018 7:12 am
Jeff B wrote:
Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:03 pm
Have the 400,1k,3k and Snow White and none of mine have cracked/spider webbed. They are the old Chocera and not the newer Pro line.
I wonder if there is a different formula with the base stones as compared to the non base or if the base alone prevents the spider web cracking.
I bought the ones without bases but they are the old Choceras and not the Pros. I did hear a few complaints back then about cracking but it mostly occurred with people that had soaked their stones.
I figured soaking wouldn't be a good idea right from the start so I just sprayed them with the spray bottle just enough to keep them wet on top.Also,I have a good stand for them and have only used light pressure.The room temperature at which I store and dry my stones in is kept right around 65 degrees this time of year.

salemj
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by salemj » Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:19 pm

The wrapping in a damp cloth is the real variable here for me—I have never heard of that before. But I'm not "in the know." Regardless, I can see how that could really exaggerate an issue like this, as it could potentially raise the humidity around the stone significantly for a long period, almost like a permasoak depending on the compound (not unlike a water based clear coat, I guess: waterproof for several minutes, but definitely absorbs water and stains if you let it sit for hours). I've had no problems with my 600 ever. It is also without a doubt one of the best synthetic stones I've used, to be honest, at least in terms of sheer performance and cutting ability (it isn't my favorite stone or anything because of the grit, etc., but I would definitely consider buying another of this brand).

Regardless, it seems like as long as you are now air drying without the towel, you can continue to use the stones without issue. Perhaps you'll turn out feeling better about them in the long run...at least I hope so!
~Joe

Comments: I'm short, a home cook, prefer lighter, thinner blades, and own mostly Konosukes but have used over a dozen brands.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:39 am

salemj wrote:
Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:19 pm
The wrapping in a damp cloth is the real variable here for me—I have never heard of that before. But I'm not "in the know." Regardless, I can see how that could really exaggerate an issue like this, as it could potentially raise the humidity around the stone significantly for a long period, almost like a permasoak depending on the compound (not unlike a water based clear coat, I guess: waterproof for several minutes, but definitely absorbs water and stains if you let it sit for hours). I've had no problems with my 600 ever. It is also without a doubt one of the best synthetic stones I've used, to be honest, at least in terms of sheer performance and cutting ability (it isn't my favorite stone or anything because of the grit, etc., but I would definitely consider buying another of this brand).

Regardless, it seems like as long as you are now air drying without the towel, you can continue to use the stones without issue. Perhaps you'll turn out feeling better about them in the long run...at least I hope so!
Actually Joe,the drying of a splash and go stone wrapped in a damp towel so as the stone would not dry out to quickly and cause the cracking,is recommended by Jon at Japanese Knife Imports and is in his description of some of their stones for maintaining them..So that is where I came up with that.Your reasoning,I have to admit,sure is a sound one when I think about it.Nope,not going to wrap them no more.Thank you Joe.

salemj
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by salemj » Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:06 am

old onion wrote:
Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:39 am
salemj wrote:
Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:19 pm
The wrapping in a damp cloth is the real variable here for me—I have never heard of that before. But I'm not "in the know." Regardless, I can see how that could really exaggerate an issue like this, as it could potentially raise the humidity around the stone significantly for a long period, almost like a permasoak depending on the compound (not unlike a water based clear coat, I guess: waterproof for several minutes, but definitely absorbs water and stains if you let it sit for hours). I've had no problems with my 600 ever. It is also without a doubt one of the best synthetic stones I've used, to be honest, at least in terms of sheer performance and cutting ability (it isn't my favorite stone or anything because of the grit, etc., but I would definitely consider buying another of this brand).

Regardless, it seems like as long as you are now air drying without the towel, you can continue to use the stones without issue. Perhaps you'll turn out feeling better about them in the long run...at least I hope so!
Actually Joe,the drying of a splash and go stone wrapped in a damp towel so as the stone would not dry out to quickly and cause the cracking,is recommended by Jon at Japanese Knife Imports and is in his description of some of their stones for maintaining them..So that is where I came up with that.Your reasoning,I have to admit,sure is a sound one when I think about it.Nope,not going to wrap them no more.Thank you Joe.

Good to know. Like I said, I'm not "in the know." I wonder, however, if this is a climate thing—I forgot about that element. Jon is in LA, which is pretty darn dry and warm year-round, especially when running dehumidifying AC. I live in the opposite realm (Pacific Northwest), and used to live in the NE, and both are obviously different. I remember this subject coming up before (climate, etc). I wonder if that relates to Jon's advice, or if this is a general practice he learned works well everywhere. I can see how certain very dry climates could cause a stone to dry too quickly and unevenly, especially after soaking, and especially given Japan's climate as the testing standard. Worth pondering.

Regardless, we DO know that the Chosera Pros seem to have sensitive bonding, and it seems as if you've found a way around that (and also got confirmation that the cosmetics won't mess too much up). I get the frustration given the price, etc., but plenty of stones are temperamental in their own ways. Hopefully this set won't prove so annoying in the long run (I can sympathize either way—I've lost patience over time for "soakers" of any sort. It is just a preference thing. I don't think they are "bad" stones, but I know they are generally "bad" for me!).
~Joe

Comments: I'm short, a home cook, prefer lighter, thinner blades, and own mostly Konosukes but have used over a dozen brands.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:15 am

salemj wrote:
Wed Feb 28, 2018 10:06 am
old onion wrote:
Wed Feb 28, 2018 1:39 am
salemj wrote:
Tue Feb 27, 2018 10:19 pm
The wrapping in a damp cloth is the real variable here for me—I have never heard of that before. But I'm not "in the know." Regardless, I can see how that could really exaggerate an issue like this, as it could potentially raise the humidity around the stone significantly for a long period, almost like a permasoak depending on the compound (not unlike a water based clear coat, I guess: waterproof for several minutes, but definitely absorbs water and stains if you let it sit for hours). I've had no problems with my 600 ever. It is also without a doubt one of the best synthetic stones I've used, to be honest, at least in terms of sheer performance and cutting ability (it isn't my favorite stone or anything because of the grit, etc., but I would definitely consider buying another of this brand).

Regardless, it seems like as long as you are now air drying without the towel, you can continue to use the stones without issue. Perhaps you'll turn out feeling better about them in the long run...at least I hope so!
Actually Joe,the drying of a splash and go stone wrapped in a damp towel so as the stone would not dry out to quickly and cause the cracking,is recommended by Jon at Japanese Knife Imports and is in his description of some of their stones for maintaining them..So that is where I came up with that.Your reasoning,I have to admit,sure is a sound one when I think about it.Nope,not going to wrap them no more.Thank you Joe.

Good to know. Like I said, I'm not "in the know." I wonder, however, if this is a climate thing—I forgot about that element. Jon is in LA, which is pretty darn dry and warm year-round, especially when running dehumidifying AC. I live in the opposite realm (Pacific Northwest), and used to live in the NE, and both are obviously different. I remember this subject coming up before (climate, etc). I wonder if that relates to Jon's advice, or if this is a general practice he learned works well everywhere. I can see how certain very dry climates could cause a stone to dry too quickly and unevenly, especially after soaking, and especially given Japan's climate as the testing standard. Worth pondering.

Regardless, we DO know that the Chosera Pros seem to have sensitive bonding, and it seems as if you've found a way around that (and also got confirmation that the cosmetics won't mess too much up). I get the frustration given the price, etc., but plenty of stones are temperamental in their own ways. Hopefully this set won't prove so annoying in the long run (I can sympathize either way—I've lost patience over time for "soakers" of any sort. It is just a preference thing. I don't think they are "bad" stones, but I know they are generally "bad" for me!).
I doubt humidity was a problem with mine cracking as I have only just begun to use it a few times this winter and the house has very low humidity here this time of year.Jon living in such a location,might make sense wrapping the stone in a towel.IDK. I had only wrapped mine twice with a micro towel that was wet and then wrung out well so as to just be a little damp.That obviously didn't work though.I do like the Chocera 800 because it is such a nice feeling stone and does a nice job sharpening a knife.

salemj
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by salemj » Wed Feb 28, 2018 11:47 am

My six feels very hard and flat and slow-wearing, and yet it is one of the best and most consistent cutters in my collection. It is a great synthetic. I don't often let it mud up, but if/when I do, the mud is also quite good and doesn't clog or slow the stone nearly as much as the mud on, say, a 320 SP. I like those qualities a lot, especially at the lower grit level. Honestly, this is my go-to starting stone for rebevels and "full" progressions on nicer knives. I'm a home cook and really don't need to drop below 1k hardly ever, but since I don't have a good 1k (I have 1.5k which is, in my view, closer to 2k and not good for this kind of work), the 600 actually cuts quick and straight, but polishes like, oh, an 800, making it perfect for this kind of work.
~Joe

Comments: I'm short, a home cook, prefer lighter, thinner blades, and own mostly Konosukes but have used over a dozen brands.

old onion
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by old onion » Sun Apr 22, 2018 4:40 am

Just a short little follow up on my Chosera Pro stones. Now my three Choseras ,the 400,800,and the 3000,all show spider web cracks.All were never soaked and only used strictly as splash and go and put on the racks to dry slowly.It's hard to enjoy sharpening when you think your hard earned money is just going to crumble away under your knife.Would I buy Choseras again ? NOPE!

nakneker
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Re: Opps Chosera 800 !

Post by nakneker » Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:00 pm

I have the Chosera 3k and just ordered a couple more Chosera stones. It’ll be interesting to see if any of them follow this pattern. I really enjoy the 3k, it’s one of the stones I like the most. Onion, is your cracking deep enough or separated enough to affect the edge. Spider cracking won’t bother be if it didn’t affect the surface of the stone. Just curious.
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