Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

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STPepper9
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by STPepper9 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:05 am

As for the reactivity, it bears mentioning that I'm a pastry chef and getting a nice patina is harder when you are primarily cutting fruit.. Also, these days I don't always get to use all of my daily drivers due to some shifts in my workload. This doesn't help patinas much either.

Cutuu
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Cutuu » Mon Nov 26, 2018 7:22 am

STPepper9 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:05 am
As for the reactivity, it bears mentioning that I'm a pastry chef and getting a nice patina is harder when you are primarily cutting fruit.. Also, these days I don't always get to use all of my daily drivers due to some shifts in my workload. This doesn't help patinas much either.
This makes total sense. A pastry chefs prep list is completely different.

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jbart65
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by jbart65 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:30 am

The Sanjo YS sure does seem to share a lot of similarity with the Yahiko Nashiji. Very similar profile and look, even if the "jackets" are different shades and colors. The YS looks ground thinner, but I do wonder if these two knives share creators in any way.
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Cutuu
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Cutuu » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:46 am

jbart65 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:30 am
The Sanjo YS sure does seem to share a lot of similarity with the Yahiko Nashiji. Very similar profile and look, even if the "jackets" are different shades and colors. The YS looks ground thinner, but I do wonder if these two knives share creators in any way.
Your right they do look strikingly similiar. Is yoshikane the supposed maker ate the nashiji?

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jbart65
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by jbart65 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:51 pm

Yoshikane is reputed to be the Nashiji smith.
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Cutuu
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Cutuu » Mon Nov 26, 2018 3:13 pm

jbart65 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 2:51 pm
Yoshikane is reputed to be the Nashiji smith.
Did you have the nashiji? Or was it two of the other yahikos.

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jbart65
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by jbart65 » Mon Nov 26, 2018 3:18 pm

I've owned at various times the Yahiko Nashiji, Yahiko Kurouchi and Yahiko Ice (bunka and 240). All are reputed to be by Yoshikane.

I've also owned the Yahiko Shimo (210 and 240) and tried the Yahiko Hammered. These are both by a separate smith who used to make farm tools.

I just picked up my second Yahiko Ice 240 and it's staying with me for good. I sold my Nashiji to try the Kurouchi, but I like the Nashiji a touch better.

Sold my Kurouchi and plan to get another Nashiji soon.
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by salemj » Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:34 pm

jbart65 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:30 am
The Sanjo YS sure does seem to share a lot of similarity with the Yahiko Nashiji. Very similar profile and look, even if the "jackets" are different shades and colors. The YS looks ground thinner, but I do wonder if these two knives share creators in any way.
As I'm sure you've gathered/remember, Yoshikane is believed to be the YS smith. It seems that, for a brief moment, Tosho listed his name to confirm this, but it is no longer on the site descriptions.

https://www.chefknivestogoforums.com/vi ... php?t=6993
~Joe

Comments: I'm short, a home cook, prefer lighter, thinner blades, and own mostly Konosukes but have used over a dozen brands.

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Drewski
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Drewski » Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:22 pm

Used my YS finally tonight. Just some very early first impressions. Stropped it on cow hide before starting. The heel falls through carrots, but halfway down the blade it was not quite as easy (say, compared to my Kikuichi Warikomi Swedish nakiri). The carrots definitely did stick to the blade but not as bad as my 270 KS or Mac Pro. When chopping up celery, I found that it was extremely comfortable rocking. Felt very natural to me, and my style is much more chopping and push cutting. There isn't much of a flat spot if you are purely chopping.
20181126_181013.jpg
Most of my work tonight was on cabbage.
20181126_175857.jpg
I thought the knife performed very well, around as good as my KS. Definitely better than my 240 Kohetsu HAP40 or Kikuichi nakiri (never used a nakiri on cabbage before, doubt I will again). The blade stalls a bit when it is halfway into the cabbage, then slides through easily. Once finished, I noticed a disturbing thing about the finish. I wiped the blade several times throughout the prep with a regular towel to dry it. Seems this may be enough to take some of the finish off. Really hoping this is not the case but I'm scared to test the finish any further.
20181126_180201.jpg
Sorry this took so long. I was feeling like I was letting y'all down but I just hadn't had the chance to use it yet for personal reasons. I'm looking forward in the future to a more comprehensive review and comparisons with my Koishi, which it looks a lot like.

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Altadan
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Altadan » Mon Nov 26, 2018 10:48 pm

Thanks for the review.
You said y'all :shock:

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jbart65
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by jbart65 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:27 am

salemj wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:34 pm
jbart65 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:30 am
The Sanjo YS sure does seem to share a lot of similarity with the Yahiko Nashiji. Very similar profile and look, even if the "jackets" are different shades and colors. The YS looks ground thinner, but I do wonder if these two knives share creators in any way.
As I'm sure you've gathered/remember, Yoshikane is believed to be the YS smith. It seems that, for a brief moment, Tosho listed his name to confirm this, but it is no longer on the site descriptions.

https://www.chefknivestogoforums.com/vi ... php?t=6993
I get forgetful in my "old" age, Joe. Vaguely seem to recall reading that, but couldn't remember where.

If it is Yoshikane, then, I'd skip the YS and get the Nashiji for $100+ less. The Nashiji is an exceptional knife. One of my favorite ones to use.

There are a few notable differences, though. The YS is ground thinner and if they are all like the one owned by Drewski, it has a rocker-pusher profile. The Nashiji is flatter and more geared toward chopping-pushing.

The Yahiko Ice is ground thinner than the Nashiji and probably also the YS. I'd contend it's the great undiscovered knife on CKTG. Just a tremendous knife in every way.
Jeffry B

salemj
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by salemj » Tue Nov 27, 2018 9:12 am

jbart65 wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:27 am
salemj wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:34 pm
jbart65 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:30 am
The Sanjo YS sure does seem to share a lot of similarity with the Yahiko Nashiji. Very similar profile and look, even if the "jackets" are different shades and colors. The YS looks ground thinner, but I do wonder if these two knives share creators in any way.
As I'm sure you've gathered/remember, Yoshikane is believed to be the YS smith. It seems that, for a brief moment, Tosho listed his name to confirm this, but it is no longer on the site descriptions.

https://www.chefknivestogoforums.com/vi ... php?t=6993
I get forgetful in my "old" age, Joe. Vaguely seem to recall reading that, but couldn't remember where.

If it is Yoshikane, then, I'd skip the YS and get the Nashiji for $100+ less. The Nashiji is an exceptional knife. One of my favorite ones to use.

There are a few notable differences, though. The YS is ground thinner and if they are all like the one owned by Drewski, it has a rocker-pusher profile. The Nashiji is flatter and more geared toward chopping-pushing.

The Yahiko Ice is ground thinner than the Nashiji and probably also the YS. I'd contend it's the great undiscovered knife on CKTG. Just a tremendous knife in every way.
I am forgetful, too. :). Better to assume one has learned and has forgotten than to assume one is ignorant of something!

I think Mark owes you a commission. I feel like you have dived into the Yahiko lines deeper and more comparatively than anyone else. I haven't tried any of them and I''m really sensitive to finishes, so I am kinda fascinated by the differences and I imagine I would fine them highly variable in use just in terms of how I feel wiping them down and such. For the most part, I really dislike Nashiji finishes in use and find them to be completely different than a satin finish or a smooth, black KU finish, to the point that I never recommend nashiji knives unless I know the person is already aware of precisely how they feel (in the same way that I tried not to recommend a KU, hammered, or damascus finish, either, although those are more "obvious" in how they are different from a satin blade).

One thing I like about the YS is the uniqueness of the pattern: it is more like a Japanese raindrop/visual pattern than a mechanical "hammer" dent. I find it very unique. I also presume that, like every Konosuke knife, there is an extra quality-control step and a special "thickness" (or "thinness") requirement that doesn't exist for the Yahiko lines. But that speculation is just to help others decide. The price difference is substantial and many would probably prefer the performance of the Yahiko for personal reasons. It is good to know the options exist.
~Joe

Comments: I'm short, a home cook, prefer lighter, thinner blades, and own mostly Konosukes but have used over a dozen brands.

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jbart65
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by jbart65 » Tue Nov 27, 2018 12:08 pm

Of all the Yahikos, I could see the Ice appealing to you. It's a very precise and elegant knife with a smooth finish. If I didn't know better, I'd think it was a Konosuke knife.

Can't say I'm especially sensitive to finishes. Tried em all. I only dislike mirror finishes or other finishes that cause undue stickage. Thankfully just a few knives have fallen into that camp.

Right now I own two knives with Nashiji or pear finishes. A Kanehiro ginsan 240 and Tanaka Nashiji 210. The Kanehiro line is quite refined, much more so than it appears in the photos.

The Tanaka is, well, the 210 I was looking for. Been using it a lot since I got it and it was the first knife my son reached for when back from college.
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Cutuu
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Cutuu » Tue Nov 27, 2018 3:49 pm

jbart65 wrote:
Tue Nov 27, 2018 8:27 am
salemj wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 4:34 pm
jbart65 wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 9:30 am
The Sanjo YS sure does seem to share a lot of similarity with the Yahiko Nashiji. Very similar profile and look, even if the "jackets" are different shades and colors. The YS looks ground thinner, but I do wonder if these two knives share creators in any way.
As I'm sure you've gathered/remember, Yoshikane is believed to be the YS smith. It seems that, for a brief moment, Tosho listed his name to confirm this, but it is no longer on the site descriptions.

https://www.chefknivestogoforums.com/vi ... php?t=6993
I get forgetful in my "old" age, Joe. Vaguely seem to recall reading that, but couldn't remember where.

If it is Yoshikane, then, I'd skip the YS and get the Nashiji for $100+ less. The Nashiji is an exceptional knife. One of my favorite ones to use.

There are a few notable differences, though. The YS is ground thinner and if they are all like the one owned by Drewski, it has a rocker-pusher profile. The Nashiji is flatter and more geared toward chopping-pushing.

The Yahiko Ice is ground thinner than the Nashiji and probably also the YS. I'd contend it's the great undiscovered knife on CKTG. Just a tremendous knife in every way.
I'm going to use it in a pro environment, so the semi stainless core and the "supposed" better edge retention, especially the edge retention, will be worth it to me, especially getting them on sale now. I also like Joe think there might be just a little extra something with the kono version but idrk.

Cutuu
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Cutuu » Thu Nov 29, 2018 11:01 pm

So, just got my ys today. After 1 meal here are my impressions. If the kioshi and kono ginsan fujiyama had a baby I think they would of gave birth to the ys.

I thought drewski said he felt like his didn't have much flat. I don't know if that has to do with looking at it rocked all the way back onto the back heel or if his just doesn't have a good flat spot. Sometimes I think if knives are looked at pushing all the way back to the back heel area it deceives the eye of the flat area. Anyways, mine has a huge flat, with a little bit of back heel,area like my ex kono ginsan had. It has the shorter heel height and feels in hand similiar to the kono ginsan.

The ys has nice stiffness and tapers some while staying stiff. It feels a little sturdier towards the front than the ginsan, but not as whispy, nor near the dramatically beautiful taper of the kono ginsan. This is where it feels more like a kioshi to me. That being, it still whipped through onions with the best of them, perhaps, partially due to the phenomenal ootb edge. The new fuji FM came with a really nice ootb edge and the ys dare I say felt even better. The edge was like silk going through both peppers and tomatoes.

The ys has a kioshi feel concerning aesthetics, including the handle. The grind sort of feels like a leaner kioshi, which I like. It seems like its a better pure cutter than the kioshi I had. Through carrots it was a little behind the kashima, but still did really well. These carrots we're on the smaller side though, so with bigger carrots perhaps, one would notice even greater difference. I do think large carrots would be a weakmess. It was fantastic at celery all though I didn't put it through the whole stalk so not a true test.

Overall first impression, I love this knife. It has meet, perhaps, even exceeded my expectations on intial use. I will approach this knife with finesse and my assessment or assumption is it requires it. I sometimes tried to push my kono ginsan to adapt a little more brute style to learn thats not the way to use it, imo. To me, it handles functionally very similiar to my ex kono ginsan but seems to have the potential of edge holding and edge taking similiar to the kioshi. Now let's add in the semi stainless core and stainless cladding. With a user comment of the ys being a little more reactive than they expecteded, I was concerned that maybe I'd have a reaction to onions or garlic being it's the first use. My kanehides tk, semi stainless, went crazy with onions and garlic on it's first use. It ruined the onions and permeated a terrible smell. It's like I felt the knife buzzing, because it was reacting so much. The ys on the other hand showed no signs of reaction through onions, garlic, and tomatoes, except a little patina on a small piece of the core steel after the session was over that I saw while putting it away.

Knifes are personal and different people have there own unique experiences, even if we often share similiar opinions. For me this knife reminded me of two knives that I liked (and miss) very much: the kioshi and the kono ginsan, which I loved(!) before Ray stole it from me. It took characteristics from each knife that I wasn't thrilled about and replaced them with strengths from the other knife, imo. For example the edges seem crisper, maybe more stable(still need more experience), and I expect the edge retention to be better on the ys than the kono ginsan. The ys feels a little more trimmed down and agile than the kioshi. On initial impression seems like it maybe a little more of a pure cutter all around. Anyways, only first impression, perhaps, with more experience with the knife I'll feel different, but so far it's a YES for the YS from me.

P.S In reality I can't really speak to edge retention, because I didn't give the knife a good enough workout to really test that. But for whatever reason some knives just seem like they are going to hold an edge for a while. That reasoning or sensation may come from knowing the specs or maybe you can actually feel it earlier than that, idk for sure.

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Drewski
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Drewski » Fri Nov 30, 2018 9:18 am

Drewski wrote:
Mon Nov 26, 2018 6:22 pm
I wiped the blade several times throughout the prep with a regular towel to dry it. Seems this may be enough to take some of the finish off. Really hoping this is not the case but I'm scared to test the finish any further.
Seems like I scared myself over nothing. Just compared the photos from now compared to when the knife was brand new, does not seem to be a change in the finish.

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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by MisoSatisfried » Wed Dec 05, 2018 10:51 pm

I have yet to really use mine, but the idea of a Kono ginsan and Koishi having a love child does resonate well with me on my initial impression. It's shape / profile is very reminiscent of the ginsan as mine has a huge flat spot as well and the tip is very similar from what I recall. Well said Cutuu. I'll see if I agree with the rest of your thoughts once I've had a chance to really use it. In some ways, I'm rather disappointed right out of the box, but in others, I'm hopeful.

It's a beauty though and I'm surprised to receive a Kono finally with such a stellar edge right out of the box.
I'm Dave. I don't take myself too seriously and you probably shouldn't either.

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Drewski
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Re: Konosuke Sanjo YS 240

Post by Drewski » Fri Feb 01, 2019 8:41 am

There's a interesting new design to the YS with a very unique handle:
https://www.instagram.com/p/BtKxtneBua3 ... eomzihsi6w

If that link doesn't work, it's just from 4 days ago on the Konosuke ig page.

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