Pass around of my product!

See what's happening with current or completed "Pass Arounds". Forum members occasionally send knives or sharpening stones around to a hand selected group of participants for short term use and feedback/reviews.
Willison_Knives
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Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

Hey guys and gals!
I'm fairly new to the scene but really enthusiastic and would love to get my product into some knowledgable hands that can give me real feedback.
I don't know how this would work from my end but I'm willing to make a knife and have it sent out to be tested by you all!
Thanks for reading! Let me know what you all think!
Dakota J. Willison
Willison Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Nmiller21k »

I'd give it a go, but my prep days tend to be VERY brutal on knives (think, 50# of onions for french onion) and 10 gallons of mirepoix...

But yeah I'd give it a test drive for you
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by jbart65 »

I'm going to wait for some of the older hands to chime in, Dakota, but I checked out your Facebook page. Good looking knives. Love to know a little bit more about what you are up to.
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by J david »

Nice work Dakota, really good looking blades. I'd like to take part , however I'm currently in three passarounds and don't want to overload my board. I'm not sure where I'm at on a couple of the lists and I wouldn't want a bunch of knives showing up all at once. If I can get through one or two, perhaps I can catch the tail end of this one.
Willison_Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

Nmiller21k wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:16 pm I'd give it a go, but my prep days tend to be VERY brutal on knives (think, 50# of onions for french onion) and 10 gallons of mirepoix...

But yeah I'd give it a test drive for you
Thats perfect! I think if it can't handle that, then I need to work on some things! Any preference in size or geometry?
jbart65 wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:21 pm I'm going to wait for some of the older hands to chime in, Dakota, but I checked out your Facebook page. Good looking knives. Love to know a little bit more about what you are up to.
Well, I'm a stay at home father who makes knives, haven't had any sale or any real tests other then myself which is only so good. Been a little over a year since my first knife. I started with swords actually and eventually found jknives and went big with a mizuno honyaki. Eventually i made it my mission to make my own. I have made some decent knives and learned alot along the way. I am currently trading a knife for some handles with Ben who is a handle maker on here. He's going to be giving me some feedback on the geometry and feel of the knife. He also gave me the idea for this. I love making them and want to get other people to actually use them so I figured this was a good way to get that done. I use carbon steels that are available to me in canada. I have looked into hamachi paper steels but its bit pricey and not really available it decent quantity for me to justify using it just yet. If I ever get a good name and people wanting me to make blades with them I will. If you have any questions please ask!
J david wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:45 pm Nice work Dakota, really good looking blades. I'd like to take part , however I'm currently in three passarounds and don't want to overload my board. I'm not sure where I'm at on a couple of the lists and I wouldn't want a bunch of knives showing up all at once. If I can get through one or two, perhaps I can catch the tail end of this one.
Well right now I'm Just going to figure out a bit more with the process. I'm thinking it might be cool to do a gyuto in w2 honyaki style. The handle I was going to have a handle maker on here make as it could help get people to try them out and he could kind of piggy back off this if that makes sense. I really like his work. Bensbites. I also need to figure out terms and conditions. I'm not concerned for the knife its self, so much as I just want to do this right lol.

And to all, I just really want brutal honesty as its the only way to learn! I would like to do a couple to show improvement of my product. One now( or as soon as I can) and one in a couple months or less

Thanks for the responses!
Dakota J. Willison
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Nmiller21k »

I'm a push cutter mostly, rock small herbs (or... you know big batches of herbs)

I want to say the Kato profile is probably my favorite.
Willison_Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

Okay, I was thinking a 240ish gyuto
I'll post the min and max and everything when I know for sure. Thanks guys!
Dakota J. Willison
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by jmcnelly85 »

I'll give it a spin, if that's cool. If I'm before or after nick it's pretty easy to swap things. Thanks for the opportunity.
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Nmiller21k »

Yeah it's almost like we're work neighbors now...
milkbaby
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by milkbaby »

Hey Dakota, I'm just a home user but sign me up on the passaround if there are slots left and/or you want more people!

I think a 240 mm gyuto would probably be the most popular choice among the mix of typical forum users. In general 210 too short for pro kitchen prep and 270 too long for home users, 240 is goldilocks size.

W2, the tool steel not shirogami #2, seems relatively popular among many makers I think because you can get really nice hamon out of it and makes a nice knife too. People get gorgeous hamon from 1095 too, and I bet with the right geometry you can heat treat and temper it pretty high hardness. The wear resistance will be lower without much alloying for carbides, but then like shirogami it'll get very sharp easily.

I think Maker Material Supply still has san mai shirogami and aogami in billets good for forging kitchen knives, maybe about 0.160" thick and 1.5" by 11" from memory. I bought one of each but I'm at the paying job right now so can't check. He also has suminigashi clad shirogami billets too which will make a really nice looking knife when forged and etched. I might be wrong but the san mai isn't crazy expensive, maybe $35-40 a billet, you could get one large knife or one medium and one small knife out of it maybe? The biggest issue is I asked other makers for heat treat advice and the best option for a backyard guy like me that only has a two brick forge was to do an interrupted quench first into brine then to canola oil (I don't have any fancy engineered quenchant oils). I'm worried about both heavy warping and the "tink of death" in that scenario, even though san mai is probably way more forgiving than honyaki or monosteel shirogami or aogami.
Willison_Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

milkbaby wrote: Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:04 pm Hey Dakota, I'm just a home user but sign me up on the passaround if there are slots left and/or you want more people!

I think a 240 mm gyuto would probably be the most popular choice among the mix of typical forum users. In general 210 too short for pro kitchen prep and 270 too long for home users, 240 is goldilocks size.

W2, the tool steel not shirogami #2, seems relatively popular among many makers I think because you can get really nice hamon out of it and makes a nice knife too. People get gorgeous hamon from 1095 too, and I bet with the right geometry you can heat treat and temper it pretty high hardness. The wear resistance will be lower without much alloying for carbides, but then like shirogami it'll get very sharp easily.

I think Maker Material Supply still has san mai shirogami and aogami in billets good for forging kitchen knives, maybe about 0.160" thick and 1.5" by 11" from memory. I bought one of each but I'm at the paying job right now so can't check. He also has suminigashi clad shirogami billets too which will make a really nice looking knife when forged and etched. I might be wrong but the san mai isn't crazy expensive, maybe $35-40 a billet, you could get one large knife or one medium and one small knife out of it maybe? The biggest issue is I asked other makers for heat treat advice and the best option for a backyard guy like me that only has a two brick forge was to do an interrupted quench first into brine then to canola oil (I don't have any fancy engineered quenchant oils). I'm worried about both heavy warping and the "tink of death" in that scenario, even though san mai is probably way more forgiving than honyaki or monosteel shirogami or aogami.
Hey!
I started and still am sort of working out of my backyard. I set up a little shop in my shed. As for the heat treat, it depends what HCR you are going for aswell how brave you are. In my expirience which isn't that much, an interrupted quench sucks lol. Might give you a slightly harder edge but it doesn't produce( for me at least) a decent hamon. I have been using peanut oil but switch over to sunflower oil as its a little easier to get in bigger quantities(found a supplier for peanut oil after the fact). It is also about the steel, the quenching being hot enough and temps being right. I don't know if those prices for the paper steels is canadian or if they will ship to me. only place i found is eBay but i will look into! Im not big on sanmai( i actually have one, but unless its SS on the outer jacket its really just pointless other then giving you a cool line) so when i do get into paper steels its still going to be honyaki. The ting of death i think( speculating from experience as i haven't had it happen and i haven't done to much in water) is the result of poor grinding more then anything. What happens is the steel cools at different rates and causes cracks. so if the blade is ground even, with good geometry(chisel ground will almost always warp!) and good steel grain structure, then a water(brine) quench will work wonders. I just don't do it atm because I get great results with oil still.
Dakota J. Willison
Willison Knives
milkbaby
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by milkbaby »

Willison_Knives wrote: Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:54 pm Hey!
I started and still am sort of working out of my backyard. I set up a little shop in my shed. As for the heat treat, it depends what HCR you are going for aswell how brave you are. In my expirience which isn't that much, an interrupted quench sucks lol. Might give you a slightly harder edge but it doesn't produce( for me at least) a decent hamon. I have been using peanut oil but switch over to sunflower oil as its a little easier to get in bigger quantities(found a supplier for peanut oil after the fact). It is also about the steel, the quenching being hot enough and temps being right. I don't know if those prices for the paper steels is canadian or if they will ship to me. only place i found is eBay but i will look into! Im not big on sanmai( i actually have one, but unless its SS on the outer jacket its really just pointless other then giving you a cool line) so when i do get into paper steels its still going to be honyaki. The ting of death i think( speculating from experience as i haven't had it happen and i haven't done to much in water) is the result of poor grinding more then anything. What happens is the steel cools at different rates and causes cracks. so if the blade is ground even, with good geometry(chisel ground will almost always warp!) and good steel grain structure, then a water(brine) quench will work wonders. I just don't do it atm because I get great results with oil still.
Yeah, MMS only has the eBay store as far as I can tell. His listings says will ship worldwide. It's $47 or $50 plus shipping for a 0.177" x 1.18" x 19.6" billet of shirogami #2 or aogami #2 that should forge out into two hidden tang gyutos. Pricey compared to some other carbon steels but definitely has the name recognition for Japanese kitchen knife knuts!

The interrupted quench was recommended to me because canola oil is still too slow to beat the ttt nose for complete hardening of the Hitachi paper steels. And I didn't want to spend on 5 gallons of engineered quenching oil either.

I think the advantage of san mai of soft carbon steel over hard carbon steel is for the large volume smiths it's cheaper (not for us buying off ebay LOL), and then many users consider it easier to sharpen since there is less of the harder abrasion resistant core steel to sharpen. I personally don't feel it's any harder to sharpen monosteel versus san mai though. Agreed that there is a bit less worrying over stainless jacketed san mai.

Looked back at your post about the 270 mm gyuto you made, and I think most j-knife enthusiasts will balk at 0.7 mm (0.027") thickness behind the edge before sharpening, although you say it performs well. I believe about half or even less is more typical, i.e. 0.015" or less. IMO, much of the kitchen knife world seems to be converging on thin behind the edge for gyutos which gives a lot of performance for slicing and initiating the cut into food.

All this is just fun discussion though, for sure you'll get real applicable feedback from a passaround! :D
Willison_Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

milkbaby wrote: Sat Apr 08, 2017 2:11 pm
Willison_Knives wrote: Thu Apr 06, 2017 6:54 pm Hey!
I started and still am sort of working out of my backyard. I set up a little shop in my shed. As for the heat treat, it depends what HCR you are going for aswell how brave you are. In my expirience which isn't that much, an interrupted quench sucks lol. Might give you a slightly harder edge but it doesn't produce( for me at least) a decent hamon. I have been using peanut oil but switch over to sunflower oil as its a little easier to get in bigger quantities(found a supplier for peanut oil after the fact). It is also about the steel, the quenching being hot enough and temps being right. I don't know if those prices for the paper steels is canadian or if they will ship to me. only place i found is eBay but i will look into! Im not big on sanmai( i actually have one, but unless its SS on the outer jacket its really just pointless other then giving you a cool line) so when i do get into paper steels its still going to be honyaki. The ting of death i think( speculating from experience as i haven't had it happen and i haven't done to much in water) is the result of poor grinding more then anything. What happens is the steel cools at different rates and causes cracks. so if the blade is ground even, with good geometry(chisel ground will almost always warp!) and good steel grain structure, then a water(brine) quench will work wonders. I just don't do it atm because I get great results with oil still.
Yeah, MMS only has the eBay store as far as I can tell. His listings says will ship worldwide. It's $47 or $50 plus shipping for a 0.177" x 1.18" x 19.6" billet of shirogami #2 or aogami #2 that should forge out into two hidden tang gyutos. Pricey compared to some other carbon steels but definitely has the name recognition for Japanese kitchen knife knuts!

The interrupted quench was recommended to me because canola oil is still too slow to beat the ttt nose for complete hardening of the Hitachi paper steels. And I didn't want to spend on 5 gallons of engineered quenching oil either.

I think the advantage of san mai of soft carbon steel over hard carbon steel is for the large volume smiths it's cheaper (not for us buying off ebay LOL), and then many users consider it easier to sharpen since there is less of the harder abrasion resistant core steel to sharpen. I personally don't feel it's any harder to sharpen monosteel versus san mai though. Agreed that there is a bit less worrying over stainless jacketed san mai.

Looked back at your post about the 270 mm gyuto you made, and I think most j-knife enthusiasts will balk at 0.7 mm (0.027") thickness behind the edge before sharpening, although you say it performs well. I believe about half or even less is more typical, i.e. 0.015" or less. IMO, much of the kitchen knife world seems to be converging on thin behind the edge for gyutos which gives a lot of performance for slicing and initiating the cut into food.

All this is just fun discussion though, for sure you'll get real applicable feedback from a passaround! :D
Dang that is thin!
See the steels i have, I can get away with using oil for quenching. But the amount im starting to use is pretty much begging for an engineered oil.
As for the pass around, I'm excited!
Dakota J. Willison
Willison Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

Okay, So the pass around is going to be
Min-5
Max-10
7 days max
200$ insurance
100 min post count
Continental Us and Canada only(I'm Canadian btw, Don't know how this changes shipping)
240mm Honyaki gyuto w2 steel
Working on it now, Hope to have it done by this week.
If anyone is willing to go first and help me out, I honestly don't have the best stones(only up to 3k) so the first person may have to twerk it a bit. I will do my best but think one of my downfalls is my edge(and part of the reason i want others to try and tell me how bad or decent it is) and I want to be upfront with everyone on everything.
Dakota J. Willison
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Nmiller21k »

I do pretty decently with edges.

Full complement of naturals / synthetics.
jmcnelly85
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by jmcnelly85 »

I'll vouch for his edges, they're no joke. That shig you sharpened was ridiculous.
milkbaby
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by milkbaby »

Sign me up! :)
Georgek
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Georgek »

I would be interested to tug along towards the end of the passaround if possible. Lowly home-cook, not a pro thought
Willison_Knives
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Willison_Knives »

Okay, So Blade is pretty much done. Just needs a final edge and a saya. Hoping to have the saya done tomorrow and edge to(i do after the saya, less risk of cutting myself and blood staining the wood lol)
This knife is going to be a personal knife. I put Bens Handle on it(BensBites handle maker)
Feels awesome! can't wait to cut something!
Im hoping to have the knife out by next week. I guess pm me and Ill post the order we are going in. Thanks for the interest! im excited! think this is my best knife yet!
Dakota J. Willison
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Re: Pass around of my product!

Post by Kalaeb »

Nmiller21k wrote: Wed Apr 05, 2017 8:16 pm I'd give it a go, but my prep days tend to be VERY brutal on knives (think, 50# of onions for french onion) and 10 gallons of mirepoix...

But yeah I'd give it a test drive for you
Really, you still cut your onions for French onion by hand? Dude, got to convince the uppers to get a robot coupe. Game changer.
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