Gyuto 210 mm - Masakage Yuki vs Kohetsu HAP40

[Alaarden]

Greetings everybody.

As the title states, I am looking for a 210 mm Gyuto. This will be my frist japanese knife and I can't decide between these two options. I would really appreciate any feedback you could provide. I am guessing that the Masakage will be easier to sharpen, but what about maintenance?

I am looking forward to your replies!

[Kit Craft]

Greetings everybody.

As the title states, I am looking for a 210 mm Gyuto. This will be my frist japanese knife and I can't decide between these two options. I would really appreciate any feedback you could provide. I am guessing that the Masakage will be easier to sharpen, but what about maintenance?

I am looking forward to your replies!

Those two knives have pretty much nothing in common. Well, they are both clad and have wa handles...

The grind is different on both. The Kohetsu appears to have a subtle convex from the spine to the edge whereas the Yuki has a partial height convex that feels fairly deep. This will cause them to act differently as one will have a shoulder and the other shouldn't.

Thickness is different too. The Kohetsu starts thin and gets thinner. The Masakage starts medium, gets thinner and then holds that all the way until the very tip and even there it has some meat.

The Yuki has a small flat near the heel, with some back belly and gently curves to the tip but the tip is still quite low to the board. It is almost santoku like but not quite. The Kohetsu has more of a continuous curve from the chin to the tip.The tip comes to slightly more of a spear tip too.

The steel is worlds apart. HAP40 is a semi stainless super steel that is highly abrasion resistant. White # 2 is a very simple carbon alloy. One will take a great edge easily and the other will hold a good edge for seemingly forever but getting that edge will be more of a challenge.

Me, I have the Yuki and I really, really like it. It was my first J-Knife. It is by no means perfect but is well balanced in performance, aesthetics and price. It is easy to sharpen, takes a good edge and holds it for a fair bit in a home setting. It goes through most product seemingly well but does not ghost through anything.

I do not have that particular Kohetsu but in general they all seem to be good value knives that flat out work. None of them actually do it for me in the looks department, though. I like my blue well enough but I have not spent loads of time with it yet.

My suggestion is to fill out the knife questioner because you are looking at very different knives.

[SteveG]

Is this for home use or pro use? The HAP40 is more of a "get it done" high performance, monster edge retention kitchen tool that is fantastic in a pro heavy prep environment. As Kit so eloquently and accurately summarized, the Yuki has much more hand crafted character and a completely different feel. The HAP40 cladding is rather soft and can get scuffed up and stained more easily than the Yuki.

For me the HAP40 is a workhorse tool and the Yuki is a functional piece of blacksmith artistry.

[Alaarden]

Is this for home use or pro use? The HAP40 is more of a "get it done" high performance, monster edge retention kitchen tool that is fantastic in a pro heavy prep environment. As Kit so eloquently and accurately summarized, the Yuki has much more hand crafted character and a completely different feel. The HAP40 cladding is rather soft and can get scuffed up and stained more easily than the Yuki.

Sorry I missed to include this information, it is for home use.

For me the HAP40 is a workhorse tool and the Yuki is a functional piece of blacksmith artistry.

Nicely expressed. I really dig the handcrafted character.

[SteveG]

Yes, the Yuki has a bunch of refined rustic character. Another knife to consider is the Kanehiro AS 210 Gyuto: http://www.chefknivestogo.com/kawa21.html. It's a similar knife, but I think the performance is a bit better and the steel has better edge retention characteristics, although it will take a little more work to sharpen. The steel will get stupid sharp, mind you, it's just not quite as easy on the stones as Shirogami (White) #2. I have the Kanehiro Ginsan Santoku and it's a fabulous knife with a lot of character as well.

Stainless clad, reactive steel core knives are not too bad on maintenance, especially once you build a patina on that reactive steel at the edge. Don't leave the knife sit wet, wipe down once in a while during prep, then wash and thoroughly dry before safely storing the knife. I have stainless clad knives that I can leave for a few minutes without worry during prep while switching product, flipping a pan, etc.

Cutting cooked poultry or beef is a great way to build a cool looking patina with blue and purple hues. Onions will generally build a gray patina that works fine, but it's not as nice looking IMO.

[Alaarden]

Thank you Steve for the information! I think I will go with the Masakage. I really dig the looks, apart of the performance.

[appleward91]

I own the hap40, and I PROMISE you will not be disappointed with this knife. My kitchen is filled with moritaka/takeda/and other top named brand knives, and people are in awe at the price I got the hap40 for and the retention. I barely sharpen this knife and holds its edge super super super well. I say go with the hap40, its a super sharp laser that will fly through everything.