Which Tanaka?

[LostHighway]

Knives from the workshop of Shigeki Tanaka seem to have a considerable following here. I'm thinking of buying one of their gyutos but which one? I'm looking at the Aogami 2 Damascus, the Aogami 2 Nashiji stainless clad or the Ginsan. The non-reactive jigane on the Nashiji and the entire blade on the Ginsan is a very minor plus but not a major factor for me. Is there any significant difference in the profiles, weights and grinds? The weights and spine dimensions look about the same for all three versions. Maybe the Damascus looks like it has a slightly lower tip? I'm primarily a push cutter and the primary application will be processing vegetables, no meat. In an earlier thread, which I can't find right now, someone here expressed a preference for the profile and handling of the 210 over the 240 but I'm open to either and I suspect it is all personal preference anyway. Which version would you buy as a first Tanaka? I know there are several people here who own or have owned all three.

[jbart65]

The Tanaka Sekiso is the big boy of the bunch.

It’s got extra weight, a meatier grind and more convexing. The profile is a gentle sweep that makes it a good rocker on herbs and such, but by adjusting the forward motion of the knife, it chops well. Pushes just fine, too.

The tip is not the thinnest, but it performs like thinner tips. The heel has some power. The blue steel is plenty tough and doesn’t microchip easily. It also holds a good edge. I’ve only sharpened mine a few times, and usually just on a Meara jnat (4000 grit or so).

The Damascus isn’t the best I’ve encountered, but it’s quite nice. And while the blade is iron cladded and fully reactive, the reactivity almost disappeared on mine after I built up a patina over a few months.

What I like about my Sekiso - still the best overall knife I have used - is that it excels at pretty much everything. Gets screaming sharp, is plenty precise, can handle any task or ingredient and doesn’t need to be babied. The nice looks don’t hurt, either.

The only other knife I own that comes close to being a one and done is my Kanehiro ginsan, but it doesn’t get quite as sharp and is not as tough.

The biggest knock on the Sekiso is the crummy D handle that comes with it. I had mine rehandled.

Oh, it’s fine for most folks. No need to get a new handle right away. But I’d recommend a new handle if you plan to keep.

Tanakas also tend to lack some of the rounding of edges at the choil and spine. It’s an easy fix with some sand paper, though I haven’t bothered. I don’t notice.

The Tanaka Nashiji is also blue steel, but it’s ground thinner. That gives it a more svelte tip and a racier cutting motion. The stock handle is much nicer and it’s stainless clad to boot.

The thinner grind, however, leaves a stickier blade that doesn’t separate food as well as the Sekiso.

By and large, the profiles of the Sekiso and Nashiji are similar. The Nashiji might be a hair flatter, but it’s by no means flat.

The Tanaka ginsan that I bought (and later sold) through another vendor has better fit and finish, with rounded edges and a much nicer handle.

Like the Nashiji the ginsan is also thinly ground and it flies through food. I seem to recall it was somewhat flatter, more laser-like and might have had slightly better food separation than the Nashiji. The tip was even more acute, but it was also a bit daintier. The Sekiso and Nashiji tips seem sturdier.

I did think the handle added a bit too much weight for my liking, though. And the ginsan was more prone to microchipping. Excellent heat treat and sharpened like a dream. Just not quite as tough as blue steel. Good edge, but it did need a bit more TLC.

The Tanaka VG10 is his most underrated knife. Another so-so stock handle, but his treatment of that steel is as good as any I have come across. Sharpens easily and is a topnotch cutter. Even more laser like than the ginsan.

The VG10 is like the Sekiso in that it lacks the F&F of the ginsan. And while they share a similar Damascus finish and more rounded profile, they cut very differently. The VG10 still speaks Tanaka, but in a different voice.

[RonAZ]

Jeffry - I've been curious about the Tanaka lines and this was a really informative breakdown of their differences. Thanks a lot for this.
Ron

[LostHighway]

Thank you for your detailed and thorough response. I think the microchipping you noted from the Ginsan probably knocks that knife out of contention although it otherwise probably would have been my first choice based on the rest of your description. I have zero experience with Tanaka's VG10 but based on sharpening VG10 knives for friends (mostly Shuns) I'm somewhat skeptical. The Damascus versus the Nashiji remains a tough choice for me. You clearly really love the Sekiso but I tend to gravitate toward thinner, "racier" blades. The handle is a non-issue and I may still get the Damascus but the extra beefiness presents a bit of psychological hurdle I'll have to get past. Thanks again, much appreciated.

[datster]

I think Jbart is spot on from my personal experience. I have had three Sekiso for several years, Gyuto, Santoku, Nakiri, definite favorites. I also have a Kurouchi and a Ginsan but haven't had enough time on them to really speak well of them. I haven't noticed any microchipping on the Ginsan but I haven't used it all that much yet. The Ginsan is definitely thinner and more laser like, I haven't had the Nashiji yet so can't compare. I also quickly rehandled the Sekisos .....

[jbart65]

Thank you for your detailed and thorough response. I think the microchipping you noted from the Ginsan probably knocks that knife out of contention although it otherwise probably would have been my first choice based on the rest of your description. I have zero experience with Tanaka's VG10 but based on sharpening VG10 knives for friends (mostly Shuns) I'm somewhat skeptical. The Damascus versus the Nashiji remains a tough choice for me. You clearly really love the Sekiso but I tend to gravitate toward thinner, "racier" blades. The handle is a non-issue and I may still get the Damascus but the extra beefiness presents a bit of psychological hurdle I'll have to get past. Thanks again, much appreciated.

Just to clarify, the microchipping is negligible. Happens to all my white knives but never affects performance. You can only feel by running your fingernail along the edge. It’s just that blue steel is tough - the toughest among the hitachi steels In my view.

If racier is what you want, the Ginsan would be my top choice. The Nashiji doesn’t whisper thru food quite the same, though I am splitting hairs.

Again, though, the VG10 Is even racier, and it’s nothing like a Shun. The steel reminds me more of Ginsan or the Swedish steel that Konosuke uses. I’d get a 240, but I don’t need a laser with that profile.

The only Tanaka I haven’t used is his R2. Supposed to be the best of all.

As for the Sekiso, well, I own lots of knives. I have thinner ones I use on some occasions or with some ingredients, but when I need just one knife, it’s the Sekiso I reach for. I especially like how tough it is and how well it performs being a mere ‘middleweight’ in terms of weight. Make no mistake. It’s a nimble knife.

[Igalor]

I have used all but the vg10. The ginsan i used was older and had a slightly thicker grind, my experiences with the sekizos and the nashiji ive used concur with what has been said before.
I have an r2 gyuto that has a grind that is very similar to the sekizo, and had an ironwood santoku that has one of the best grinds ive ever seen, ground very thin with a full convex that started really high, and the handle is fantastic. It is the best cutter ive used so far, but im not a santoku guy, so i sold it. I would like to get an ironwood 240 with the laser grind, but they got super expensive over the last few years.

[LostHighway]

Just to clarify, the microchipping is negligible. Happens to all my white knives but never affects performance. You can only feel by running your fingernail along the edge. It’s just that blue steel is tough - the toughest among the hitachi steels In my view.

If racier is what you want, the Ginsan would be my top choice. The Nashiji doesn’t whisper thru food quite the same, though I am splitting hairs.

Again, though, the VG10 Is even racier, and it’s nothing like a Shun. The steel reminds me more of Ginsan or the Swedish steel that Konosuke uses. I’d get a 240, but I don’t need a laser with that profile.

The only Tanaka I haven’t used is his R2. Supposed to be the best of all.

As for the Sekiso, well, I own lots of knives. I have thinner ones I use on some occasions or with some ingredients, but when I need just one knife, it’s the Sekiso I reach for. I especially like how tough it is and how well it performs being a mere ‘middleweight’ in terms of weight. Make no mistake. It’s a nimble knife.

Thanks for the clarification. I was reading micro less literally, more along the lines of simply very small as opposed to can be felt but not visible to the naked eye. That may shift things back toward the Ginsan, or possibly even the VG10 if I can overcome my prejudices. The R2 just isn't in the budget for the near future. I'm sure I'll have give the Aogami 2 Damascus a try eventually but it might not be my first Tanaka.

[ChefKnivesToGo]

I just started doing customs with his Sekiso line. This handle was done with wood from Ben Greenberg. It's Japanese Sugo wood and really looks great on Shigeki's gyuto: https://www.chefknivestogo.com/tasebl2gy24c.html

Here is a quickie video I did of Shigeki Tanaka at his hammer last May. https://www.instagram.com/tv/BnjzKqbjBW ... _copy_link

Here's a link to Ben's website if any of you want to do a custom handle for yourselves. http://greenbergwoods.com/