Some basic sharpening questions

[beanbag]

Hello folks,

So I got some of the Masutani knives from this site, and I was so impressed with their out-of-the-box sharpness, that I also went and got the Imaninshi 1k/6k combo stone so that someday I can touch up those knives, as well as sharpen up some of my other knives.

As background, I have a bunch of Victorinox chef / utility knives, most of which are still reasonably sharp out of the box, but on one or two, I tried sharpening with a Lansky system, and made them worse than the default. So these I would use for practice. I also have a 10+ year old Kai Wasabi knife that is still very sharp, but I think the edge is starting to get beat up, so that needs a "touch-up". The Masutani knives I am afraid to mess up while being a noob, but someday they will need a touch-up too.

Looking closely at the Masutani factory edge, it looks like a very coarse grind, perpendicular to the cutting edge, and making a convex taper. And then the very tiniest polished bevel at the edge. I don't know what are the + and - to this kind of grind, but it does seem to work well, namely that it can easily start a cut in thick-skinned fruits, but also doesn't get stuck half-way in. Maybe the coarse grind gives toothy micro-serrations?

Anyway, a bunch of beginner questions:

How long am I supposed to soak my stone for, anyway? If I put in a tiny amount of detergent, will that help the water penetrate faster via reduced surface tension?

If there is a good reason to go with this type of edge, how would I go about making it?

I looked at a few sharpening videos, and a lot of the Japanese ones have you scrubbing one part of the blade at a time, while the videos from westerners try to hit the entire edge in one stroke. + and - of each style?

If I go with the edge type that leaves coarse scratches with only the tiny polished edge, does it matter what angle the coarse scratches are?

Now that I have the stone, is there any need for a honing stick? Maybe just splash some water on the stone, two swipes each side?

Thanks

[Gregory27]

Bump, I'd only be guessing at a few of these, but I'm sure loads of you could help out here.

[Kit Craft]

I do not have that stone but I have a load of Imanishi stones and most of them are soakers. To check, drop it in a tub of water and watch the bubbles. If it does not bubble at all, it does not need to be soaked. If it does bubble but only from the 1k side, soak only the 1k side. If both sides bubble leave it in the water until the bubbles stop. That is how I work things. Sometimes a stone will not need a soak but will need a few squirts of water here and there while in use before it holds its water.

No need for dish soap, btw.

I don't have those knives either but judging from the pictures I do not see what you do. I see a simple grind and an edge bevel. Maybe I am just not reading what you are saying correctly. Regardless, lay the knife flat on the stone and slowly, with little to no pressure, push the knife forward and lift the spine at the same time. Once the edge bites into the stone you have found your edge. You want to lower the knife, toward the spine, a wee bit (maybe a degree or three) and sharpen until you raise a burr on one side. Flip and repeat. After you have a burr on both sides do the same as before but with less strokes and less pressure. Reduce pressure to almost the weight of the blade and strop back and forth one stroke on one side and switch until you can no longer feel a burr.

I would do this with just the 1k for awhile. Once you get a good edge from the 1k you can add the 6k in. When you do that there are two ways you can go. You can either just strop on the 6k side or polish and strop. Up to you. Regardless, start at half pressure on the 6k and do not spend much time on one side before flipping. You do not want to raise a burr again, there is no need. You are simply refining what you already have.

Scrubbing in sections or full sweeps, does not matter. Whatever you are comfortable with. Likewise, edge leading or trailing does not matter so much as long as YOU get the results that you want. I like pressure on trailing strokes only and I sharpen in sections to raise a burr and switch to sweeps to clean it up. That is just my way of doing things, though.

As for the honing rod. If it is a steel, maybe it is useful if you keep some soft knives. If it is ceramic it is useful if you want to keep an edge coarser than 6k but finer than 1k. You can strop on the stone dry, btw. No need for water to strop two or three strokes.

PS: Maybe you are referring to the grind when you say coarse scratches. If that is the case, that is your thinning angle and you should not need to thin for a touch up, only for a full progression and even then you can probably get away with not thinning for three or four full progressions.

[cwillett]

I am definitely not an expert, but let me try to answer a couple of your questions from a non-expert perspective.

Soak your stones until you don't see bubbles coming out them. Or just about 10 minutes. Or more depending on what is going on. Longer soaks affect different stones differently. I probably wouldn't use detergent. The soak time is so little anyways.

I mostly work in sections on my knifes, though on a shorter knife I'll try to get the whole blade in like is shown, for example, in the Bob Kramer videos. I find the sections approach work better for me as I'm just controlling the front-back motion, as opposed to also moving side to side. I suspect that as my technique improves I'll migrate to the whole knife approach.

I'd keep the honing rod. I still use it with my German knives to knock off any burrs that have formed in between sharpening sessions. My Japanese knives tend to get touched up weekly on strops instead.

[Ourorboros]

1 Not all stones need to be soaked. If they do, see what people have to say in the item's review. But as said, soak until no more bubbles. From experience, the first time takes he longest. Soap is not recommended.
2 This is a micro bevel - the edge is ground more acute on coarser stones & finished at a more obtuse angle on the finest stone. Theoretically it gives the best of both worlds - more durable edge from the obtuse angle, slides through food like the acute angle.
3 Either can work. Skill will be a more important determinant.
4 Yes, yes it does
5 No need for a honing rod unless you are on the go & in a hurry. How you go about it is entirely determined by the state of your edge.