My apologies in advance for the long post. I’ve been using an EdgePro for a lot of years now and think that I can consistently get some really good edges off it. Just on 12 month’s ago I started a journey into freehand sharpening. I’ve done a lot of research and watched a lot of videos and tried to distil out of all that, the useful stuff. So firstly, “Thanks” to all of you who have contributed to that knowledgebase because it’s helped me a lot.
Here’s where I’m at. I sharpen ambidextrously, spine towards me, scrubbing backwards & forwards, using slightly more pressure on the edge-leading stroke than the edge-trailing stroke (probably because of my time on the EP, I’m pretty comfortable with feeling the edge-of-the-edge on edge-leading strokes). I can get reasonable bevels and edges off the stones that cut paper quite well & can sorta cut hair off my arm.
The two areas that I have struggled with are (i) the curve from the main part of the blade to & including the tip and (ii) removing the burr on the stones with very light edge-leading strokes. No surprises there.
I learn by my subconscious brooding and eventually some sort of answer drops out, if that makes any sense. I was reading in a post by @ken123 (here viewtopic.php?f=4&t=4846), where he refers to a video (here https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... DsWh_M7Rek) and from designing jigs in the ‘90’s I was aware of the principle detailed. But the timing just aligned with the other stuff that was in the spindryer of my subconscious and this is what fell out and I tried it out and it worked for me. Nothing radically new, and it may already be out there – I just haven’t come across it so far.
So the key is that the part of the edge you are grinding, moves perpendicular to the stone (belt etc) & I tried it on my 4” Shun Premiere paring knife, which was past due for a return to the stones. Using the plastic angle guides to set & occasionally check, I was aiming at a main bevel of 14º & a micro bevel of 16º.
The flat of the blade was pretty straightforward, & using three fingers to apply pressure gave a good full stone width telltale of swarf on my white stones. Witness marks in engineer’s terms. Checked and there was a nice bevel. Moving onto the problem areas for me, I adjusted the angle of approach around the curve and up to the tip, so that the edge was always perpendicular to the length of the stone. I then used one or two fingers to move the pressure point and found I had to adjust the height of my hand (elbow?) holding the knife a little, to get the pressure point to “move” on towards the tip.
Again, I could tell where I was & what was happening at the edge, by the witness marks left on the stone. (Wash the stone off occasionally.) This continued to give good results. I’ve seen lots of references to lifting your elbow to get the right edge angle through the belly & tip area. That’s all good, but I drove myself mad trying to work out how high for what angle of approach and I ended up with some crazy combinations, finding one that was a bit weird, but that I could sort of get to work.
With this new process, I knew exactly where I was, all the time, simply by watching the witness marks (plus listening / feeling etc). A slight variation of the above also made abrading the burr off, much more simple than previously.
Straight off the stones it would cut phonebook paper and arm hair pretty easily. A light strop on bare leather took it to another level. So that’s good progress for me and there’s obviously a good edge in there somewhere battling to get out.
This has just unlocked what was a bit of an obstruction to my progress. Lots more practice required obviously!!
ONE OF THOSE EUREKA MOMENTS - I THINK
- ken123
- Posts: 5342
- Joined: Wed Jan 25, 2017 2:53 pm
- Location: Northern California
- Has thanked: 253 times
- Been thanked: 316 times
- Contact:
Re: ONE OF THOSE EUREKA MOMENTS - I THINK
Congratulations! You have overcome a SEA of misinformation out there to get to the point of understanding you have achieved - not an easy task!
Here's to ever sharper edges...
---
Ken
Here's to ever sharper edges...
---
Ken
Re: ONE OF THOSE EUREKA MOMENTS - I THINK
I knew exactly which video you meant before I checked. That one helped me a lot, too.
When I explain sharpening the belly I tell new sharpeners that the goal is to keep the bevel on the stone. They will lift the heel to do that, but the point is not to lift the heel of the knife, that's just a side effect of using a comfortable sharpening motion. Explaining why they should expect to raise the heel and their elbow not as the method but as a byproduct has been effective. I also pointed one guy to that video, it is particularly helpful even among Ken's mountain of information.
When I explain sharpening the belly I tell new sharpeners that the goal is to keep the bevel on the stone. They will lift the heel to do that, but the point is not to lift the heel of the knife, that's just a side effect of using a comfortable sharpening motion. Explaining why they should expect to raise the heel and their elbow not as the method but as a byproduct has been effective. I also pointed one guy to that video, it is particularly helpful even among Ken's mountain of information.
-
- Posts: 1863
- Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:44 am
- Location: Auckland, New Zealand
- Has thanked: 361 times
- Been thanked: 591 times
Re: ONE OF THOSE EUREKA MOMENTS - I THINK
Thanks Ken & Lepus. Coming to that conclusion has moved me on from struggling to figure out which way & by how much should I lift my elbow (no boundaries and no real indication that I'm at the right spot) to finding the edge-of-the-edge at the part of the blade I want to work on. I can now do both of those and my elbow doesn't even come into my thinking. The set-up for my elbow just falls out of getting the other two things correct.
Cheers Grant
Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean they're not going to get you!!
Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean they're not going to get you!!
Re: ONE OF THOSE EUREKA MOMENTS - I THINK
I've been freehand sharpening for probably 2 years or more at this point and can make a pretty sharp knife but am still nobody's expert. This post really helped me. The concept is so intuitive and everything clicked into place when you wrote it.
thanks,
Danny
thanks,
Danny
-
- Posts: 1863
- Joined: Fri Jan 27, 2017 2:44 am
- Location: Auckland, New Zealand
- Has thanked: 361 times
- Been thanked: 591 times
Re: ONE OF THOSE EUREKA MOMENTS - I THINK
Hi Danny & thanks for your thoughts. I could sort of manage before, but this looks to be something that is repeatable and consistent for me. As I said the next step is just more practice.
Cheers Grant
Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean they're not going to get you!!
Just because you're not paranoid doesn't mean they're not going to get you!!