My most practical "finishing" stone

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Kit Craft
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My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by Kit Craft »

I just got done with a session on a mixed lot of kitchen knives. A set of Suisin Inox Western, a pair of Tojiro DP and Fujiwara FKH (family knives). And I have to say I still think my most practical finisher, although not one in a the purest of sense, is still my Aono Aoto. I have tried dozens of stones after it and dozens before it and I keep coming back to it. Why, well because I think it reaches beyond its own capabilities. It gives an edge in the 3-4k range with the bite of a stone in the 2k range but it can polish out 500 grit scratches quickly and without question. It can leave a nice edge on hard carbon, soft stainless and more relaxed PM steel. It has wonderful feedback and is not only ease to use but a joy. It leaves an okay working finish for a kasumi and a good matte going on shiny finish on mono steel. And it cost me like $100 including shipping and nagura...(Thanks Ken!)

This is not my favorite stone and not even my most used stone but I do enjoy it and I do think it is the most practical stone, aside from a bevel setter, that I own. Yes, that includes synthetic water stones as well.

Is it the best butchery edge, no, I get that from my monzen-to but those two stones have a ton of overlap and I think the Aono is more versatile, is the better buy and has 99% as good of an edge for that one dedicated task while having a better edge for others. It does not leave a finish near as fine, in edge quality nor cosmetic beauty as a Takashima but again I think it is more versatile. It still has better feedback and is slightly easier to use. The edge is about 75-80 as refined but has a wee bit more bite too it. It is also much cheaper and easier to find as well. It leaves a wonderful edge on a paring knife, a petty, a honesuki, a deba and a gyuto etc. I think no other stone that I have would I use on so many knife types. Normally I want a different finish for different sorts of knives. I still might go a lot higher on a Yanagi though.

It isn't just today's session that brings this up. I have been getting a lot of PMs as of late in regards to natural stones, which I enjoy btw, and just thought I would say that this is the number one stone I recommend when people ask. It falls somewhere between mid grit and finisher and is a good starting point when jumping into the rabbit hole and while not a one size fits all rec I do think it is a stone that damn near every natural stone enthusiast should experience. One that can open up the eyes of any one new to naturals as well. Where to jump off from there is a totally different story! And particularly because the Aono is about as dead center of a stone that you can find in every way. You will learn if you want to go harder and less muddy or softer and more muddy or maybe stay somewhere in the middle. If you want a fast stone that leaves some bite or a slow stone that polishes to no end. Etc the list goes on.

This is a no-brainer for somebody who has not yet built a preference for stone type as well. I think this is how many people feel about the suehiro rika but I will choose a natural over a synthetic as often as possible. :P

What says you? What is your most practical or most versatile stone in your setup aside from your 1k(ish) stone? That one stone that you recommend to everybody you ever talk to...lol

PS: I am pretty sure I have rambled on similar to this before. If so, ignore me. And no, I have not been drinking. Just have the cabin fever from being pent up.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by gladius »

I had almost the exact same thoughts the other evening. The aoto covers that transitional grit range from mid-to-fine and fits well in most progressions as well as provide a nice base from which to progress with naturals.
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Kit Craft
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by Kit Craft »

gladius wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:32 pm I had almost the exact same thoughts the other evening. The aoto covers that transitional grit range from mid-to-fine and fits well in most progressions as well as provide a nice base from which to progress with naturals.
You know that I have had many stones since then but I just can not get over how versatile it is. I have even had other and arguably better aoto but that one is just a user. I pandered too long and did not pick up the one that Watanabe had that was HS 39 and he compared to a 5-6k stone. I don't recall who did get it but I believe it was a regular. I bet that would have been one hell of an aoto but again, probably not near as versatile. Still would have loved to have tried it but I can't try them all, well, unless I hit the lotto. Even then some people are faster. :P
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by gladius »

I have several aoto's, the one I use most is the softer one (from Ken) because of the speed and nice matte scratch pattern. The other two (from JNS) are harder but do leave a finer finish. I also have a monzen and red aoto but don't regularly use these much except on wide bevels and combined on synthetics (try some monzen mud on SP2k). I almost always precede fine finishing naturals with aoto.
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Kit Craft
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by Kit Craft »

gladius wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:49 pm I have several aoto's, the one I use most is the softer one (from Ken) because of the speed and nice matte scratch pattern. The other two (from JNS) are harder but do leave a finer finish. I also have a monzen and red aoto but don't regularly use these much except on wide bevels and combined on synthetics (try some monzen mud on SP2k). I almost always precede fine finishing naturals with aoto.
Red aoto as in atagoyama akapin or okabana akane? I assume the former as you said JNS.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by ken123 »

I do have more :)

I particularly like using these after either a 1k or 2k synthetic to 'push' the edge a bit further. It just brings out a lot of knives to a higher level of function.

I also love my Meara. I recently got a pair (of these). Wish I could get more.

---
Ken
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by gladius »

Kit Craft wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 4:54 pm Red aoto as in atagoyama akapin or okabana akane? I assume the former as you said JNS.
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Yes, Atagoyama - nice finish too.

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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by J david »

I pandered too long and did not pick up the one that Watanabe had that was HS 39 and he compared to a 5-6k stone. I don't recall who did get it but I believe it was a regular. I bet that would have been one hell of an aoto but again, probably not near as versatile. Still would have loved to have tried it but I can't try them all, well, unless I hit the lotto. Even then some people are faster. :P
I have one like this that I recently listed for sale with a couple other aotos. The other two sold first and I retracted this one. I'm glad I did because it is a unique stone.

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My go-to finisher is a mystery stone that I got on the cheap. I would estimate it starts ~6-7k but gives an incredibly toothy edge. If I work it for a while, it can finish around 10k. I wish I knew what it is so I could find more.

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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by Cutuu »

Big fan of my Aono Aoto.
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Kit Craft
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by Kit Craft »

Gladius, thanks. Yeah, I have heard a lot of people like those red 'aoto'. There is another fellow that I talk to that has a red, a green and one that is a mix of red and green.

JD...that aoto looks really cool. That mud looks like something you would see on an Uchi or a slightly muddy but hard Ohira suita! And the pattern is coo! That mystery stone is cool. You always end up with cool mystery stones!

Cutuu, me too and it shows.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by dafox »

ken123 wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:00 pm I do have more :)

I particularly like using these after either a 1k or 2k synthetic to 'push' the edge a bit further. It just brings out a lot of knives to a higher level of function.

I also love my Meara. I recently got a pair (of these). Wish I could get more.

---
Ken
Ken, i would like one, please pm me, thanks.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by dafox »

Kit, thanks for the write-up, and sharing your exprrience, I've learned a lot from you over this last year. I've been wanting to use a natural stone but have had no idea where to start, this sounds like a good place to begin.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by nevrknow »

dafox wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:17 am
ken123 wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:00 pm I do have more :)

I particularly like using these after either a 1k or 2k synthetic to 'push' the edge a bit further. It just brings out a lot of knives to a higher level of function.

I also love my Meara. I recently got a pair (of these). Wish I could get more.

---
Ken
Ken, i would like one, please pm me, thanks.
Second on this pm price please Ken?
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Kit Craft
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by Kit Craft »

dafox wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:39 am Kit, thanks for the write-up, and sharing your exprrience, I've learned a lot from you over this last year. I've been wanting to use a natural stone but have had no idea where to start, this sounds like a good place to begin.
No problem. I just want to share my thoughts because I have been getting a lot of PMs recently, due to my reviews I assume and thought this would also work as a general first step suggestion. :) Also, I see a lot of people make out J-nats to be something super difficult to use enigmas that only very experienced sharpeners should consider and I simply do think that the case. Also that some people point out that sytnethics are ALWAYS more efficient than synthetics and I also do not find that to be true. I think that something like an Aono, and a few others, is easy enough to use that one could learn on it as a secondary stone to their bevel setter. Also in general I find Ohira suita, not all, but many, many of them to be as fast if not faster than syntetics in the same finish range.

Regardless, my point is that I wanted to share because I think a lot of people who are interested in natural stones are nervous about getting their feet wet and I think part of that is due to generalities that get spread. Sure, if you are in a pro environment where ever second counts our you only use steel with 4+% Vanadium content then maybe those generalities stand but for many people I think naturals are efficient enough, at least within the 80-90% range of synthetics, to enjoy without worry. Beyond that and as I said above people can at times make it sound like you need to have tried a dozen synthetic stones for a decade before you can pick up a natural stone...Please, that is silly!

Sorry, I really just enjoy naturals and I had a good session yesterday! I just think, that for me at least, naturals leave a better edge finish for finish than any synthetic most of the time. :) More bite with your refinement and for longer periods of time, or so I feel. Heh, I fell into this rabbit whole really deep two years ago! Hard to believe I have only been playing with J-nats for a little over two years now.

Anyway, you seem to really give a lot of thought to what you do and I think you will get the most out of naturals.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by ken123 »

dafox wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:17 am
ken123 wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:00 pm I do have more :)

I particularly like using these after either a 1k or 2k synthetic to 'push' the edge a bit further. It just brings out a lot of knives to a higher level of function.

I also love my Meara. I recently got a pair (of these). Wish I could get more.

---
Ken
Ken, i would like one, please pm me, thanks.


The aoto are $80. I also have optional tomonaguras for them for $20. Shipping is 13.50.

I prefer PayPal for payment to ksskss@earthlink.net . Please put what you are getting and your current shipping address in the PayPal comments .

Call anytime 209 612 2790 for any questions.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by dafox »

ken123 wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 4:47 pm
dafox wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 11:17 am
ken123 wrote: Thu Apr 12, 2018 5:00 pm I do have more :)

I particularly like using these after either a 1k or 2k synthetic to 'push' the edge a bit further. It just brings out a lot of knives to a higher level of function.

I also love my Meara. I recently got a pair (of these). Wish I could get more.

---
Ken
Ken, i would like one, please pm me, thanks.


The aoto are $80. I also have optional tomonaguras for them for $20. Shipping is 13.50.

I prefer PayPal for payment to ksskss@earthlink.net . Please put what you are getting and your current shipping address in the PayPal comments .

Call anytime 209 612 2790 for any questions.
Payment sent, thank you.
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by jacko9 »

Ken,

I have been finishing on the 3K Nubatama stone I got from you - what would you recommend I use after that?

Jack
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by ken123 »

Enjoyed our conversation ! The Meara is an excellent choice !

---
Ken
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Re: My most practical "finishing" stone

Post by jacko9 »

ken123 wrote: Fri Apr 13, 2018 8:50 pm Enjoyed our conversation ! The Meara is an excellent choice !

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Ken
Looking forward to using it.
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