Stone recommendations

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metamorpheus
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Stone recommendations

Post by metamorpheus »

I currently have the DMT XXC diamond, a Mercer 1000/3000 combo, a Kohetsu 2k, a Naniwa Superstone 5k, a balsa wood strop, and a bovine leather strop. The Mercer combo is on the lower end and I would like to just leave it at work for the cheaper knives there. My only good knife at home is a Kohetsu HAP40 210mm gyuto, but I have no intention of stopping there. I like using my Kohetsu 2k and Naniwa 5k a lot. The Naniwa is somewhat easy to gouge, but it's really smooth and I like the feedback as a new sharpener. The swarf produced in edge leading strokes and feel let me know if I'm using even pressure, enough pressure, have a good angle, and etc.

I'm looking for a coarse stone, 320 grit or 500, a new 800 or 1000 grit stone, and less importantly an 8k down the road.
The Shapton glass 500 looks like a good choice for a lower grit stone. I realize the feedback won't be as nice as some of my other stones, but like the splash and go factor, portability, the dishing resistance, and ability to sharpen harder steels. I'm trying to experiment with the balance between tooth and refinement in my progression. I started my Kohetsu gyuto on a brand new(not broken in) DMT XXC, so the scratches run pretty deep in the bevel. It's basically micro serrated and you can hear the teeth at work with raw meat and tomato skins, which is fun. I'm thinking of using a 500 before the 2k in my progression. The 1000 or 800 options are a little harder to narrow down. I'm looking at the Kohetsu 800, SG 1000, the Chosera 800 or 1000, The red Bamboo 1200, or the green Bamboo 1000. For 8k I have no idea. Any thoughts?
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Jeff B
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by Jeff B »

I have the Chocera 400 and 800 and they are both fast cutters, great feeling stones and true splash-n-go, two of my favorites. Like Chocera over Shaptons in this range. The Naniwa Snow White(Junpaku) is an excellent 8K. https://www.chefknivestogo.com/ornasnwh8k.html
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old onion
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by old onion »

The Kohetsu 800 would go great with your Kohetzu 2k that you already have and they can both be soaked, The Choseras are nice also and they are splash and go stones,no soaking required.I have the 400,800 and the 3000.When I use those,I follow up with either my Rika 5k and/or my Snow White ( Junpaku). The Rika requires a brief soak but the SW is splash and go.My lowest stone is the Shapton Pro 320 and I can't say that I really care for it that much but I have heard good things about the SG 500 you are considering.
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by Radar53 »

+1 to old onion. I also have the Kohetsu 800 & 2k and the K800 makes a great companion stone to the 2k
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gladius
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by gladius »

+2
Kohetsu 800 is a good choice and can bridge the gap between the XXC (use very light pressure) and the 2K. The 800 is a strong cutter as is the 2000 (easily cuts HAP40). The Naniwa SS 5K is a super finisher (use edge trailing strokes only)...strop on bare leather and it is hard to beat.
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by cedarhouse »

+3...only more strenuously.

If you are just getting into stones, it can be alluring to jump around and experience the variety of stones out there. But this is tricky. In my imagination the Naniwa SS is a soft, muddy, silky stone for taking your time a nursing a beautiful edge.

The Kohetsu is a take no prisoners, get s**t done stone.

The Chosera are a luxury offering SS like edges and feel, faster cutting, and splash and go convenience.

The SG is like the Kohetsu only with less feel...I think of the SG as a sharpening stone for people that don't like sharpening. They work like crazy, but they don't encourage you to lavish in the exercise.

The problem is dancing between these can lead to scratches at certain grits not being erased because one stone in the rotation lacks the muscle. More problematically, these differences change your subjective experience of sharpening...and remember being a good sharpener is all about consistency. You want to eliminate variables wherever possible. So...

I add my +3, get the Kohetsu 800. I think the world of the Kohetsu line. They are great stones. If you want to play with other lines later, build new, cogent progressions. I have three or four different rotations with little overlap in stones between these rotations because once I begin, I want consistent predictable performance and feedback throughout the sharpening session.

As an addendum, I don't see a problem with keeping the SS in the rotation. You do most of the work in the coarse and middle grit ranges. A change-up on the finisher is not a huge problem. Likewise, starting on a diamond plate to do big repairs is acceptable because there is a fairly concrete visceral step between those phases of sharpening. When I am doing a repair, I will often do the grunt work in the garage with coarser tools, then finish sharpen in my kitchen. That is as much a function of where my kit tends to live as anything else, but it helps to get me into a groove.
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ken123
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by ken123 »

Instead of the SGlass 500 consider the Nubatama platinum 600- much better feel and feedback and you can go from there to a 1500 grit stone directly. From there you can go to a 4k stone ( 4k ume) which will be creamier and slower dishing than the 5k ss stone. From there although I like the 8k snow white, the new 8k ume is my new top dog for 8k stones.

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Ken
metamorpheus
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by metamorpheus »

Thanks for the replies, that clears things up. I'll go with the Kohetsu 800 and the Chosera 400.
I spent 5-6 hours sharpening today on my cheap Mercer, a Knives of Alaska D2 folder, and touching up the HAP40. Guess I fall into the like to sharpen category, it's not just utility for me. Feel like I've learned a lot and got all 3 sharper than they've ever been for me. I learned to scrub around curves with a folder, learned to walk up to the tip while scrubbing, learned to maintain good angle control at faster speeds, developed a steady fluid stropping motion, and now I have abraded shallow fossae onto the medial sides of both thumbs(I do an ambidextrous scrub and use the thumb of my leading hand to control and reference the angle).
I Love that Naniwa 5k SS. I used it on the Kohetsu HAP40 again today, stropped with 1 micron paste on balsa, and then stropped on bare leather and now it's perfectly balanced between toothy and polished for me. Ghosting bell peppers was my goal for the knife and it's doing that now. I'm still going to get those stones, but I'll probably just strop and occasionally touch up with the 5k for a while on this knife. Just have to get another J knife to experiment with.

Gladius, you say trailing strokes only and you're not the first person I've heard say that. I gouged into it a little bit when I first started using it, but I can now do edge leading strokes as part the walking scrub motion with good results. Most of the pressure I apply is on the trailing stroke and I do finish with stropping strokes though.
metamorpheus
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by metamorpheus »

ken123 wrote: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:12 am Instead of the SGlass 500 consider the Nubatama platinum 600- much better feel and feedback and you can go from there to a 1500 grit stone directly. From there you can go to a 4k stone ( 4k ume) which will be creamier and slower dishing than the 5k ss stone. From there although I like the 8k snow white, the new 8k ume is my new top dog for 8k stones.

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Ken
Is this the one you're referring to-Bamboo 600 205x75x30 Platinum $109.48? What are your thoughts on forgoing the 400 chosera and 800 Kohetsu and doing a progression like Platinum 600, Kohetsu 2k, SS 5K, balsa with 1 micron paste, and bare bovine leather? I'll consider the 4k ume down the line, but I want to utilize what I have already minus the Mercer. I just got my first whetstone 4 months ago and acquired a lot of what I have recently. The 8k is a lower priority currently, but when it's time to get one, I'll send a message.
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ken123
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Re: Stone recommendations

Post by ken123 »

If yiu are going that route you could stsrt with the 600 - the one you specified - and follow with the Kohetsu ( I have not tried this stone). Next I would go to the 5k Nubatama bamboo. You could improve your strop setup later.

Ken
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