So got one of the “young samurai” yanagiba - not very sharp at all out of the box so looking for a little advise. Have watched some of the videos that have been posted.
My initial questions are really on which of my stones to start with. Forgive my terminology.
Stones I figure are appropriate (that I currently have) Shapton Pro in 1000 and 5000 and a nubatama 2000 I got from Ken.
So should I start with the 1k or 2k? I know the back is sharpened much less and primarily with the fine stone although the video (don’t recall the name) of one of the Japanese masters showed him using every grit on the back. As delivered there is not really a flat n the back at the edge (realize that it should be small ~1mm or so).
I know on the front you just go by the existing bevel - finger pressure near shinogi, although one video indicates front bevel having 2 angles. Will use sharpie and see the initial bevel.
I see a phone call with Ken in my near future the rabbit hole is getting bigger - lol
Yes a 1k/5k combination will work fine for them. Ideally you want to go flat on the stone on the back side and flat on the shinogi on the front side and you want to use both stones on each side. If the shinogi is not perfectly flat to the edge you can raise the angle a little until you are on the edge by putting extra pressure with your fingers on or near the edge as you observed in the video. Or you can spend some time flattening it out.
unboxed my Young Samurai 270 yani last night. Geez Paul, you are right this sucker could use a edge put on her. I own no full size stones as I sharpen using an EP. Would the Naniwa 1/5K combo be a decent combo stone to learn on? The other two candidates that may see use would be my Tojiro Honesuki and possibly my CCK cleaver.
I'm fine with spending $100, but would prefer not to spend more than that initially (unless warranted) to see if this whole freehand sharpening thing goes anywhere.
Won’t comment on the specific combo as have not used it but per marks comments it will prob work. Others have much more experience. I originally was going to make an edge pro - I have a full size machine shop as a hobby - but after using one of the clones a bit I found the propensity to scratch the sides of the knife unacceptable to me, so ditched the idea and went freehand. I’m fairly good at stuff like this so holding fairly consistent angles is not a big deal,and I’m getting quite good results (I’m no pro though).
Anyway this is my first single bevel and basically had no real edge out of the box (t3chi3 if you got a nice edge using only 5k your knife started out much much sharper than mine). Anyway it’s much better now but needs another session. Few interesting things I found (pausing to look up terms) there was/still is in some spots a hollow on the kireha surface (front blade surface)as noted by using a sharpie, I was clearing off steel up at the shinogi and down at the edge but there was a hollow in the middle, also a few inches along the blade edge were not contacting the stone so I did not establish a burr along the whole edge (reason for needing another session).
Still very happy with the purchase but will give Ken a call this evening, may want to explore stones that generate more mud or at least some.
Good luck
I didn't get to the 240 or 270 before they were sold out and have never sharpened a single bevel kitchen knife. I did get a stone from Ken that I used to flatten the backs of my wife wood chisels so you might ask about the Nubatama 1K xxhard stone to see if he thinks that might be a good match for this application. Yes phone calls with Ken and long (also expensive since he has such great stuff).
The 1k to 5k jump will be fine (though that nice hazy finish will be lost).
To mitigate scratches on your blade face you might want to add the ,2k in between, but that's more for aesthetic reasons than practical.
Remember, get it sharp on the 1k, and only when you're done there move on to the next.
I did mine on a cheap 1k\6k, and then finished on a takashima tomae for some mirror finish. Honestly, I could have used a middle Stone between the 1 and 6, and then some more time finishing, to really get the looks.
The blade, however, was pleasingly sharp. The tuna almost cut itself just by proximity to the blade
“If we conquer our passions it is more from their weakness than from our strength.”
― François de La Rochefoucauld
Let's explore the anatomy of a yanagi and follow this up discussing stone types ideal for this procedure.
So typically a yanagi is ground on the front surface on a large stone wheel - typically about 1 meter in diameter (~39 inches). Inherently this produces a concave grind. If you rotate the blade off from perpendicular to the stone, you reduce the depth of the concavity. Depending on the user's skill you approach a flat surface. In practice it is rarely flat. Often it is wavy with hollow areas overgrinds etc.
You can take several approaches - ignore this variability, partially fix it or completely flatten the surface. Note that even completely flattened doesn't mean that you have an edge - just a flat plane.
Now if you choose a very hard stone, you will just hit the high spots, not getting an even surface at all on the blade. If your stone is a finer grit you won't hit the lower spots or the hollow areas. The first part of this equation is to select a coarser stone than you might otherwise choose. I would suggest avoiding diamond plates for this - you will get deep scratches and edge chipping. A stone is a much better choice. You might think I would go for the 150 Bamboo, but it is too hard. Too hard? Many say it is too soft. I would suggest a 180 Nubatama - much softer and more forgiving. The mud goes to the depths of the surface variations and yields a much more uniform finish. Think of putting trim on the floors of a house. Those 45 degree joins never seem to fit perfectly so you put caulking in there to fill in the variations and PUFF - now you look like a good carpenter!
You need to get that surface flat and sharp. If you don't get a good coarse edge you wont ever get it truly sharp.
Once this initial work is done the rest follows. Muddy stones are a great help for this work.
Here is a Moritaka. It is double beveled but the principles apply to single bevels. This knife also had deep scratches from an Atoma initially that needed to be removed. Following this procedure, I went on to use an Ohmura natural stone.
the rabbit hole is getting bigger - lol
