First set of stones.

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ChefKnivesToGo
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First set of stones.

Post by ChefKnivesToGo » Thu Nov 08, 2018 8:28 am

Hi Mark,

I need some recommendations on a nice first set of knife sharpening stones. I would like to get into hand sharpening and been looking at the Naniwa super stones. Possibly in 400, 1000 & 3000/5000.

Do you have any recommendations on stones and grits?

Thanks,

James
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by ChefKnivesToGo » Thu Nov 08, 2018 9:51 am

Try this James. I like the stones better: https://www.chefknivestogo.com/ar7pcesset.html
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jacko9
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by jacko9 » Thu Nov 08, 2018 10:52 am

Thats a pretty good set to get started. Just add a Sharpie pen to mark the leading edge while you practice to control your sharpening angle and your all set.

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Jeff B
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by Jeff B » Thu Nov 08, 2018 12:48 pm

I like the Shapton Pro a lot more than the Naniwa Super Stones. The Naniwa Super Stones are to soft for me, gouge easily and dish more quickly. They seem geared more to the Razor community.
220 or 320, 1k, 5k makes for an excellent set. The 2k is a great stone to add later, best finisher for soft stainless. The Shapton Pro case doubles as a stone holder or you can buy a dedicated holder. Add a diamond plate for flattening too.
Can use a cork in place of a felt block and can usually find a sharpie around the house.

A great set that will get you started for just over $200 and will last for years.
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/shaptonpro.html
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/sustho.html
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/140grdistflp.html
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cwillett
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by cwillett » Thu Nov 08, 2018 1:22 pm

You'll probably be pretty happy with most choices. For general guide lines, and without reference to expense, here are some thoughts.

1. Get a very low grit diamond plate. This is helpful for maintaining stones, but also for sharpening knives that are really out of tune. I do this a lot for friends with German knives that haven't been sharpened since they were purchased.I like the Atoma 140: https://www.chefknivestogo.com/at14dipl.html

2. Get a low grit stone in the 220-400 range. For the above mentioned German knives, this comes next. I also use it as a base stone when doing a full progression on a Japanese knife. I can get a bevel set very easily, or lightly thin a knife as needed. I use a Suehiro Cerax 320. I don't think it is fast enough for my tastes, but certainly does well and has great feedback. It is soft and dishes easily. If I were to do it again, I'd probably look at other options. Here is the link:
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/bunmei3pcset.html

3. Get a medium grit stone in the 800-1000 range. This is your workhorse stone. It is the terminal stone for the above mentioned Germans and for my utility knives (pocket, hunting, garden, etc). Most of your time should be spent here refining the bevel you set with the low grit. There are lots of options here. I use, and like, the Suehiro Cerax 1k, but I doubt there is a bad choice here. I like the feedback and the feel. Here is the link:
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/tcblla24gy.html

After this, you have a lots of options. Some people like small gaps between stones and will go from 1k->2k->3k->5k->8k->10k->strop. Other people have small gaps. I jump to 5k and then 8k in a full progression. I'd probably choose something like the Suehiro Rika 5k and then fill in details as you get experience.
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/suri50grst.html

I'd highly recommend getting the basic strop kit and a felt strop:
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/haamstkit.html

CKTG doesn't seem to carry the felt strop any more. The strop kit will maintain your edges on a weekly basis. The felt strop gets used in between stones to deburr the edge. I find it very helpful.

I'd really recommend focusing on the lower grit stones and getting an edge that will push cut paper off of the 1k (or whatever medium grit you choose).

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Re: First set of stones.

Post by arthurfowler » Thu Nov 08, 2018 11:51 pm

There is some great advice here already. I have far less experience of sharpening than the guys above but I will share my experience. I am a home cook with 36 J knives so I don’t need to sharpen that often. I really enjoy sharpening and want to keep improving so I am now using my Anyru gyuto as a practice knife for sharpening. As I enjoy sharpening, I have a few stones including Shapton Pro, Shapton Glass, Nubutama Platinums and 3 natural stones. Interestingly I think I put my best ever edge on the Anyru with a SP1k mainly, then some light passes on the SP2k and 5k and finally a light strop on leather.

I think the secret is to keep it simple at first. Lots of more experienced people have posted before on this so buy some decent stones like Shapton’s/Naniwa/Suehiro etc from Mark so then you know without doubt that any errors early on your journey are not due to the stones.

As above, I would go with the Shapton Pro’s as they are splash and go and the case doubles as a stone holder.

So I would recommend as others above have above: -

SP 220
SP 1000
SP 5000
Diamond flattening plate - I have the Atoma 140 but there are cheaper options
Wine cork and a Sharpie

With what you save on not buying a stone holder, I would recommend buying a practice knife like a Tojiro W2 series and constantly use this to perfect your technique.

Then later on, if you really enjoy sharpening and once your technique and outcomes are far more consistent, you can play with different stones.

Good luck and enjoy!!

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Re: First set of stones.

Post by Thuja Magus » Sun Nov 11, 2018 2:51 pm

I started on super stones, never liked them. Slow, load up fast and was to soft. Buy nice don’t buy twice.

Shapton pro are amazing value and I think the feedback is nice some people think otherwise but if you never used anything it doesn’t matter.

You could also get a Shapton Glass 500 and a 2000 in either pro or Glass. Plenty fine for kitchen knives.

I never bothered to deburr with cork, just practice on stones and grind down your burrs.

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Jeff B
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by Jeff B » Sun Nov 11, 2018 7:43 pm

Thuja Magus wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 2:51 pm
...I never bothered to deburr with cork, just practice on stones and grind down your burrs.
I grind down my burrs but still use felt or a cork too just incase. ;)
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cwillett
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by cwillett » Sun Nov 11, 2018 9:18 pm

Felt works really well for me. It has the extra benefit of helping to remove rust and stains from my EDC knife which normally doesn't get cleaned and oiled regularly.

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Re: First set of stones.

Post by nakneker » Sun Nov 11, 2018 11:06 pm

I pretty much tried every synthetic stone I could buy over the past 10 months. My opinion? I’m not sure sure it matters too much what stones you buy, technique is worth far more than the stones. My favorite stones are Shapton glass and Suehiro Demados but that’s just a personal preference. Buy Shapton, Chosera, cerax or whatever you find that fits your budget and then practice practice practice technique. My edges today are better than they were 10 months ago, I hope they improve yet again over the next 10 months. Peter Nowlan and Mark have some videos that are simple and very helpful. I’d recommend them and avoid much of the garbage found on you tube. Finally, this forum is full of really nice people who will offer help if asked. It’s a tremendous resource.
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old onion
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by old onion » Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:16 am

Yea,what nakneker said .

datster
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by datster » Mon Nov 12, 2018 9:28 am

nakneker wrote:
Sun Nov 11, 2018 11:06 pm
I pretty much tried every synthetic stone I could buy over the past 10 months. My opinion? I’m not sure sure it matters too much what stones you buy, technique is worth far more than the stones. My favorite stones are Shapton glass and Suehiro Demados but that’s just a personal preference. Buy Shapton, Chosera, cerax or whatever you find that fits your budget and then practice practice practice technique. My edges today are better than they were 10 months ago, I hope they improve yet again over the next 10 months. Peter Nowlan and Mark have some videos that are simple and very helpful. I’d recommend them and avoid much of the garbage found on you tube. Finally, this forum is full of really nice people who will offer help if asked. It’s a tremendous resource.
old onion wrote:
Mon Nov 12, 2018 8:16 am
Yea,what nakneker said .
Good advice right there if you are just starting your journey. You are going to hear about feedback, hard, soft, fast, slow, etc. but until you experience some of it, it will only blur the path. As you go you will find you like some of your first stones a lot, maybe others not so much, then you can try different ones in their place to find what fits you. Just because I like a stone doesn't necessarily mean you will, but there is a ton of experience and explanation here that will help you make good choices to get closer to what you are looking for when you start looking.

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Re: First set of stones.

Post by Martin » Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:17 pm

what grits of the stone are the most essential? is 220/1000 combo stones sufficient for carbon steel?

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Re: First set of stones.

Post by lsboogy » Sun Nov 18, 2018 12:03 am

Martin wrote:
Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:17 pm
what grits of the stone are the most essential? is 220/1000 combo stones sufficient for carbon steel?
A 220/1000 will get you a decent edge, but most of us are at 6K or better for use. I would suggest a low grit (220 or 329) to set a bevel, a 1K for initial edge, and a couple of finer stones. I get my nieces and such 1K/3K Cerax stones as a first line of sharpening stuff. I use a few rough (320 or so) stones when a knife is really dull, and then a 1K/2K/6K or finer progression. Sharpened a few knives earlier today, started with 1200 Nubatama, then 2K green brick, 6K Nubatama and then stropped - knives are sharp enough for me

cwillett
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Re: First set of stones.

Post by cwillett » Sun Nov 18, 2018 11:48 pm

Martin wrote:
Sat Nov 17, 2018 11:17 pm
what grits of the stone are the most essential? is 220/1000 combo stones sufficient for carbon steel?
220/1000 would be a good start and all you really need for German steel or utility knives. If you've gone to the expense of getting a good Japanese knife, I'd add a higher grit stone in the 3-5k range AFTER you're comfortable getting a good edge with the 220/1000. A felt strop can help with burr removal, but eventually you'll want to take most of the burr off by stropping on the 1k side. I find an Atoma 140 plate to be invaluable as a starting point for many knifes, including my EDC and other utility knives and pretty much any knife that a friend wants me to sharpen. I like the leather or bovine strop from EDC, utility, or German knives, and loaded (1 micron, 0.5 micron pastes) strops (balsa, nano) for Japanese knives.

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