Carbon Skillets

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Bensbites
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bensbites »

mauichef wrote: Mon Dec 03, 2018 3:31 am
Kalaeb wrote: Sun Dec 02, 2018 9:21 pm
mauichef wrote: Sun Dec 02, 2018 11:08 am

I'm curious why you would think that when no one has even seen one of these yet.
Because it is made through the same process...or at least it seems so from his IG. It is a pre-cut piece of steel pushed into a mold with the sides machined thinned... Am I missing something?
Well you learn something new every day!
I didn't realize that Matfers are thinned on a lathe. I thought they were just made from a circle of iron pushed into a mold so the sides end up the same thickness as the bottom.
Shibata is a craftsman, I (and I assume we) have developed a respect for his skill and craftsmanship in the product he produces.

With a knife, I can’t find anything similar for in a mass production blade. I have no doubt his knives are worth every cent, I have enjoyed using them even if I don’t own any.

With a skillet, especially carbon steel, I am curious to hear about the difference between craftsman produced vs mass produced. I expect this skillet has the same art over fuction with top notch fit and finish.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

Drewski wrote: Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:13 am
Bluenoser87 wrote: Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:21 pm Got a mineral b 14” today! This thing is a beast. It dwarfs my 12 lodge cast iron
Totally! Wish I had a gas stove for such a wide cooking surface.
A gas range is the way to go for sure.

After playing around with this for a few days I think I understand some of the seasoning confusion. These don’t seem to behave quite like cast iron or even carbon woks somehow. I tried seasoning this like I did my cast iron in the oven and it was not at all nonstick.

I then tried blackening the oil on the stovetop like I did my wok and food stuck and the seasoning flaked off. It looked really good though.

I then tried following the debuyer instructions and it worked perfectly, go figure. Heat up a bunch of neutral oil until it smokes and swirl it around in the pan. Let it cool down then throw out the oil. Done. Seems like you can’t rush the seasoning on these and I’m sure it’ll blacken more over time. Eggs slide right off now. I’m impressed.
C39DD03E-6540-49FB-87A1-202B9DBD1198.jpeg
old onion
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by old onion »

Bluenoser87 wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 11:39 am
Drewski wrote: Mon Dec 03, 2018 12:13 am
Bluenoser87 wrote: Sun Dec 02, 2018 8:21 pm Got a mineral b 14” today! This thing is a beast. It dwarfs my 12 lodge cast iron
Totally! Wish I had a gas stove for such a wide cooking surface.
A gas range is the way to go for sure.

After playing around with this for a few days I think I understand some of the seasoning confusion. These don’t seem to behave quite like cast iron or even carbon woks somehow. I tried seasoning this like I did my cast iron in the oven and it was not at all nonstick.

I then tried blackening the oil on the stovetop like I did my wok and food stuck and the seasoning flaked off. It looked really good though.

I then tried following the debuyer instructions and it worked perfectly, go figure. Heat up a bunch of neutral oil until it smokes and swirl it around in the pan. Let it cool down then throw out the oil. Done. Seems like you can’t rush the seasoning on these and I’m sure it’ll blacken more over time. Eggs slide right off now. I’m impressed.

C39DD03E-6540-49FB-87A1-202B9DBD1198.jpeg
I tried that Debuyer method and heated the oil till it smoked,dumped it out and let it cool completely.What a gooey mess.
Bluenoser87
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

old onion wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 12:40 pm I tried that Debuyer method and heated the oil till it smoked,dumped it out and let it cool completely.What a gooey mess.
Strange. I got a gooey mess with the oven method. The finish on mine now is not even a little bit tacky. I just used regular canola oil, for what it’s worth, and scrubbed with hot water once everything cooled off. Looks to be pretty much bulletproof now.
gastro gnome
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by gastro gnome »

Every time I've ended up with a gooey mess, it was because I used too much oil. I have not seen de Buyer's instructions and have not followed them, so I can't vouch for them one way or another.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Kalaeb »

You guys are killing me...
No smoking oil, no goopy mess, no insanely hot ovens just daily use :)
Image
Paper thin crepes, no problem.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

Kalaeb wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:23 pm You guys are killing me...
No smoking oil, no goopy mess, no insanely hot ovens just daily use :)
Image
Paper thin crepes, no problem.
The smoking oil thing only takes a few minutes and for me wasn’t goopy at all. All it really does is get a head start on the seasoning that will develop naturally over time. If that avoids some sticking food along the way it’s a no brainer.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

I finished some NY strip steaks in the mineral b tonight. This thing is phenomenal. It’s as good or better than any Teflon pan without all the plastic. It kind of has me questioning my current pan lineup a bit. If someone had introduced me to Japanese knives and carbon pans 10 years ago my kitchen would look a little different I think. Although, at the recent rate I’ve been collecting j-knives maybe it’s for the best this hasn’t been going on for longer...
Bensbites
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bensbites »

Bluenoser87 wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:13 pm I finished some NY strip steaks in the mineral b tonight. This thing is phenomenal. It’s as good or better than any Teflon pan without all the plastic. It kind of has me questioning my current pan lineup a bit. If someone had introduced me to Japanese knives and carbon pans 10 years ago my kitchen would look a little different I think. Although, at the recent rate I’ve been collecting j-knives maybe it’s for the best this hasn’t been going on for longer...
I have trouble beating Teflon for scrambled eggs. Everything else goes in Stainless, CI or CS.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

Bensbites wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:28 pm
Bluenoser87 wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 10:13 pm I finished some NY strip steaks in the mineral b tonight. This thing is phenomenal. It’s as good or better than any Teflon pan without all the plastic. It kind of has me questioning my current pan lineup a bit. If someone had introduced me to Japanese knives and carbon pans 10 years ago my kitchen would look a little different I think. Although, at the recent rate I’ve been collecting j-knives maybe it’s for the best this hasn’t been going on for longer...
I have trouble beating Teflon for scrambled eggs. Everything else goes in Stainless, CI or CS.
Fair enough. I haven’t tried that yet. Pork chops, steak, and fried eggs are a breeze so far though. I purged all my Teflon a long time ago, but I’m guessing scrambled eggs will work better in carbon than my current method of letting them stick to stainless and complaining about it haha
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

I made some scrambled eggs in the mineral b this morning just to see how it would work. They slid right off with only a little bit of butter. No sticking at all. Wild
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by gastro gnome »

Bluenoser87 wrote: Wed Dec 05, 2018 12:07 pm I made some scrambled eggs in the mineral b this morning just to see how it would work. They slid right off with only a little bit of butter. No sticking at all. Wild
While I risk Kalaeb's ire for continuing to make this carbon steel discussion overly complicated and fussy, I am curious how you scramble.

I typically would use Gordon Ramsay's cold pan method described here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PUP7U5vTMM0. It start with cold eggs in a cold pan and folds them as the pan heats up. It maximizes the size of the curds. This has not worked in carbon steel pans. If you'll notice, he does sautes some other elements of the recipe in carbon steel and specifically switches to a different type of pan to do the eggs. In other videos, he seems to do the eggs in a nonstick, teflon-coated pan.

I have no doubt you can do some kind of scrambled eggs in a carbon steel pan where the pan is more thoroughly heated. I have done it too. But the eggs aren't as fluffy. I have found that if the CS/CI the pan is not thoroughly heated, things will stick. So I don't think this particular technique works with this particular piece of equipment.

Of course, this is a very particular, time-consuming and somewhat fussy technique to achieve a very particular result. If people have been able to use their well-seasoned, vintage, or artisan carbon steel or cast iron pans to do this (or a similar technique), then I will admit defeat and accept that my seasoning just needs to improve. Short of that, I think there may be a limit to just what these pans can do. Of course, if you do not cook eggs this way (or use other cold-pan-start techniques), you may find that CS/CI pans do satisfy *all* usages and that you can safely eliminate all other pans you like less. That's not been my experience.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

I start with a hot pan with some butter. I’ve never tried it cold with any sort of pan. I’ve found stirring in a little bit of water after scrambling the eggs but before adding to the pan makes them much fluffier.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by old onion »

I had good luck doing nice fluffy scrambled eggs in my Matfer omelet pan. I pre scrambled three eggs in a bowl,salt and pepper,then poured in my warm pan with Ghee and used my wooden spatula and worked the egg from the side and into the middle,constantly until nice and fluffy and moist.I had no sticking at all.Felt like a teflon pan.Now that I said that,I'll probably never be able to repeat it.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by old onion »

Bluenoser87 wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:33 pm
Kalaeb wrote: Tue Dec 04, 2018 5:23 pm You guys are killing me...
No smoking oil, no goopy mess, no insanely hot ovens just daily use :)
Image
Paper thin crepes, no problem.
The smoking oil thing only takes a few minutes and for me wasn’t goopy at all. All it really does is get a head start on the seasoning that will develop naturally over time. If that avoids some sticking food along the way it’s a no brainer.
Oh sure,cover up the entire bottom of your pan so we can't see your lousy seasoning job. :lol:
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by old onion »

Oops,that last post was a leg pulling meant for Kalaeb,noting that he covered up the bottom of his pan with a big ol crepe. :D
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Bluenoser87 »

It’s a nice looking crepe!
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by old onion »

Bluenoser87 wrote: Wed Dec 05, 2018 4:15 pm It’s a nice looking crepe!
Yep,it's a nice looking crepe.I'll give him that.I am thinking some good tasting stuff rolled up in that baby.
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by Kalaeb »

[/quote]
Oh sure,cover up the entire bottom of your pan so we can't see your lousy seasoning job. :lol:
[/quote]

Debuyer on the left, Newquist on the right.

In the beginning I tried everything to get that cool black mirror seasoning. Lard, flax, grapeseed etc...- I tried doing it in the oven @500, over a natural flame. The flax seasoning took the best and gave the best appearance (whatever that means), but after a few uses it just started flaking off ( I have a bunch of flax oil that I will never use, if anyone wants it let me know and I will send it to you). I have scoured the debuyer down to bare metal three times and always took it back up to a 1k polish...no easy job. I was so sick of stripping the pan I almost vowed to never use carbon again. I gave it one more shot and just used it, dealing with a little sticking early on. After each use I wipe down with a little canola oil. If I burn something in the bottom I will scour it with some rock salt. This is about a year of use. The Newquist on the right usually only gets used for things like crepes, pancakes, grilled cheese and eggs. The Debuyer usually takes all the proteins and higher temperature searing.
Image
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Re: Carbon Skillets

Post by old onion »

Kalaeb wrote: Thu Dec 06, 2018 12:40 am
Oh sure,cover up the entire bottom of your pan so we can't see your lousy seasoning job. :lol:
[/quote]

Debuyer on the left, Newquist on the right.

In the beginning I tried everything to get that cool black mirror seasoning. Lard, flax, grapeseed etc...- I tried doing it in the oven @500, over a natural flame. The flax seasoning took the best and gave the best appearance (whatever that means), but after a few uses it just started flaking off ( I have a bunch of flax oil that I will never use, if anyone wants it let me know and I will send it to you). I have scoured the debuyer down to bare metal three times and always took it back up to a 1k polish...no easy job. I was so sick of stripping the pan I almost vowed to never use carbon again. I gave it one more shot and just used it, dealing with a little sticking early on. After each use I wipe down with a little canola oil. If I burn something in the bottom I will scour it with some rock salt. This is about a year of use. The Newquist on the right usually only gets used for things like crepes, pancakes, grilled cheese and eggs. The Debuyer usually takes all the proteins and higher temperature searing.
Image
[/quote]
You've done to your Debuyer what I have done to my Matfer. Got sick of stripping mine down too after doing it twice with Bar Keeper's friend and starting all over again with a seasoning oil that other's have sworn by.The first seasoning on the pan was Flax seed oil and I though I had bragging rights for awhile because it was a beautiful shiny black and I no sooner said how great it was and the next day I noticed the seasoning flaking off. Embarrassed, I never brought it up.No more Flaxseed oil.I think the wife threw the bottle out after she seen me trying to choke the bottle and beating it to death while calling it some very bad names.I have tried other oils too and I think Avocado oil does the best,I like grapeseed too but you really have to use a very thin coat or it will come out gummy.Still,it doesn't take much to ruin what you have done with any of them.I had a good thing going until I cooked a ham in mine and it lifted the seasoning right off and turned a black bottom to white.I put some Grapeseed oil in the bottom this time and heated it up good for about 5 minutes and let it smoke,dumped it out,wiped it down and now I have a beautiful ocean design with waves,thick waves. :(
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