Professional Knife Recommendations

[timbc]

I've worked in fine dining for a few years now, and finally have been able to save up money to justify upgrading to new knives as well as expanding for versatility. As I've worked up in the industry the demand of having sharp knives for variable tasks only increase in importance, and my current single chef's knife can struggle to keep up with all the work. I've done a lot of looking around personally, as well as asking for recommendations from co-workers and friends. While I have saved up some money to invest in a new solid knife, I can't quite justify spending a fortune on a single knife. I'm hoping that there are some people who have been in my similar situation and can give me some additional pointers to help me narrow down my search.

1. Pro cook.
2. Primary interest is in a solid Gyuto, although I'm also am looking to invest in a Petty as well as Sujihiki for various tasks during prep and on the line.
3. For a Gyuto somewhere between 210-240mm, reference towards 210mm. For a Petty around 150mm. For a Sujihiki, anything around 250mm.
4. I'm willing to invest between $200-400 individually on a well made knife which will last me a long while, with proper care each day.
5. Leaning towards a full Carbon Steel, but am open to anything.
6. Both are comfortable, with a preference towards Japanese handles.
7. Primary work knife has been a MAC Pro 8" for the last few years.
8. Knife skills are very solid.
9. For most work rocking is ideal, however I apply push and pull cuts when needed, like butchering fish.
10. I know how to sharpen and care for my knives.

[Kerneldrop]

I'm not qualified to make a recommendation....but if you went Kurosaki then you could get all from the same line and have that familiarity...
https://www.chefknivestogo.com/allkukn.html

[cliff]

I am not a pro, so take with several grains of salt. From what you describe, stainless-clad AS sounds ideal. For the gyuto, Y. Kato makes an excellent, relatively affordable one (in stock here -- https://www.chefknivestogo.com/kawa21.html). You mentioned carbon, but R2 is worth considering. If you can find one, Takamura's 210 red handle is about as good a deal for a high performing knife as there is. I think Ogata is worth looking at if you want something a little taller.

I like Ashi Ginga for a petty and suji, but note that they use Sakai sizing and the wa-versions run small. What are you looking to do with these? All purpose, or is there something more specific? I like a thinner suji for fish, but if you are carving roasts all day, you might want something with some heft.

[billk1002]

These would hold an edge for quite a while are are semi-stainless, I cant help but think that Mark stocks these for just your purpose.

https://www.chefknivestogo.com/kohawahakn.html

[Jeff B]

A popular knife in pro kitchens. Has an Aogami Super carbon core that's popular with the pros and has stainless cladding for easier maintenance.Kato AS Gyuto 210mm

A full stainless that's also popular with the pros.
Shiro Kamo SG2 Damascus Gyuto 210mm

[jmcnelly85]

As a pro, I would throw the lions share of the budget at the gyuto and fill out the roll with cheaper options from there. My daily driver at work is an Ogata 240, and I couldn’t be happier with it; however, his knives are out of stock at the moment. Shiro Kamo taught shungo Ogata, and his R2 210 and 240 are both in stock and is one of the best performing blades I’ve ever had my hands on. It doesn’t meet your carbon preferences, but it’ll take an edge just as good as most carbons, and hold it noticeably longer while there. If you really want a full carbon I’m very happy with my moritaka, but only have hands on experience with his long nakiri. (Outstanding knife for a precise garnish assassin or bulk hammer.).

I do absolutely love the kurosaki and kato recommendations for something in stock as well, my kurosaki has spent nearly a decade in at work and still sees serious use. Keep your Mac handy though, it’ll be better at filleting a snapper than a new gyuto. After you sharpen your gyuto for a decade it’ll make a great fish knife but new I would treat whatever gyuro you grr as a vegetable processor.

If you do go Kamo, that leaves 300-900 of the budget for the rest. A kanehide TK or kohetsu hap40 150 petty will perform in the realm of the more hand made options while not running into some of the fruit related issues some petty’s see while not crushing the budget.

The slicer is where usage really comes into play, I use a very flexible 270 that is discontinued and don’t know a good alternative off the top of my head for it, or I’ll use a 10’inch f dick breaking knife or a 12 inch victorinox scimitar for a lot of my big slicing duty. In all honesty I think a 240-270 yanagiba might work for you but don’t have hands on experience to steer you in a direction outside of saying the Mac stainless single bevel isn’t a bad knife as long as some dipshit doesn’t put it through a chefs choice but that’s a different story.

Stiff slicers handle big beefs and things better, but something thin and whippy is butter through a salmon. Gun to my head my favorite slicer might be my f dick breaker and I think it’s only 30 bucks, the biggest con about it is it’s the salt bae knife, but it certainly is capable. That’ll leave budget room for some western boning knives, a Mac paring knife, a good roll, stones…

Or for that special factor, stick with full carbon and buy everything by doi. https://www.chefknivestogo.com/keijirodoi.html

[Kerneldrop]

What separates the knives when you start getting into the levels of Kurosaki, Shibata, Yoshikane, Doi, Kato, Shiro, etc…

[aporigine]

What separates the knives when you start getting into the levels of Kurosaki, Shibata, Yoshikane, Doi, Kato, Shiro, etc…

I suspect subjective factors dominate.

Each pro cook has his or her style, intensity, product type and quantity … it spans the spread of knives mentioned plus the Dexters etc. that most pros use.

So one person may groove on Yoshikane but not like Shibata, another may think Kurosaki read her (!)ing mind, and so on.

Best I got; corrections welcomed

[salemj]

Can you provide any more personal details? I feel like you are a very experienced user. Some forum users have a broad sense of how a knife might connect to individuals. For example: are you tall or short? Do you have decent space at work or are you often working in very tight spaces? Mostly prep work or mostly line work? It is easy for you to wipe down knives during the shift, or do things get a little messy? And finally, if your main knife is a Western handle, is there a reason you prefer Japanese for the new ones? I'd also be curious if you touch up knives during a shift, and if you have any preferences for blade stiffness.

It is hard to recommend carbon now-a-days with so many great stainless options. While I think AS can be great (as recommended above), I've always felt Kurosaki knives are designed a bit more for aesthetics and home use rather than professional use (I'm not a pro). I feel like Kurosaki tends to offer a lot of cosmetic finishes, but as a pro, I'd prefer something like the Ogata recommended above or a monosteel: slick, easy to wipe down, easy to care for, no bling, and all about performance.

I love the stiffness, balance, and predictability of monosteel. Given you are used to a Mac (which I feel are extremely stiff and live on the board in general), I can imagine you might appreciate similar qualities. Most of my knives are clad, but I'm a home user. Whenever I want to get rough or cook with no concern, I tend to favor a monosteel. While it may seem crazy (given that they are overpriced now), I bet something like a Suisin Inox 240 would be a pretty amazing option. These knives are "low tech" by modern standards, but I find the swedish stainless is hard, keen, and has a good bite while also being easy to refresh on the go. I would avoid the 210, as they still come with a short heel height that may not be as versatile as you need. You could also get a stiff and live feel from a harder PM, like a HAP40. I've never used one, but Mark's Kohetsu HAP40s seem to have a good reputation among pros and probably offer a similar stiffness and simplicity (other members please correct me if I'm wrong).

There are so many good options in your range...I'm hesitant to write anything without having more personal preferences and information! But this is exciting: you're enjoyment of these upgrades should be huge.

[XexoX]

... In all honesty I think a 240-270 yanagiba might work for you but don’t have hands on experience to steer you in a direction outside of saying the Mac stainless single bevel isn’t a bad knife as long as some dipshit doesn’t put it through a chefs choice but that’s a different story. ...

Do Tell!

[Kerneldrop]

No experience with these, but they are advertised as “pro” knives, in stock, within your budget and offer every profile you mentioned:

https://www.chefknivestogo.com/kielcastkn.html

[jmcnelly85]

... In all honesty I think a 240-270 yanagiba might work for you but don’t have hands on experience to steer you in a direction outside of saying the Mac stainless single bevel isn’t a bad knife as long as some dipshit doesn’t put it through a chefs choice but that’s a different story. ...

Do Tell!

The story of that knife offers a glimpse into the industry. I’m the third chef of a restaurant, the first chef bought the yanigiba as a gift for the first sous before the restaurant opened; however, shortly before we opened the sous relapsed and went on a meth fueled bender and lost his job before it even started and the gift knife turned into a house knife. When I was a line cook, me and the first chef were the only two who would properly sharpen it while using it and how I treated knives and food is one of the reasons I got bumped up from line cook, to lead line, to sous (third in line at this place) but then Covid happened and restaurant decided to part ways with the original chef… I part ways and take a head chef job to pretty much pull a kitchen nightmare situation to fix a resort restaurant and part ways with a full blown crazy lady and find myself as the number two sous at the original restaurant. While I was gone the now head chef has repeatedly put the single bevel through a work sharp (I accidentally referred to it as a chefs choice earlier) so I chew the chef out for attempting to ruin it, take it home and spend a good 4 hours with a coarse stone to get it to the point of not ruined, and tell the chef to never do that again and yards yadda… flash forward to when I took time off to have my first kid, chef kills the knife again with a work sharp and I refuse to touch the knife ever again cause now I dont have time to do this again. Shortly after my return that chef gets canned for being a hack and I get the executive chef position, I notice one of my line cooks is at least sharpening his own knives and in the stage of buying all the thrift store knives to thin out and modify and all the things so I give him the project of bring this home and fix it up and feel free to use it and learn and on and on… just know this is still the restaurants knife…few months go by and this kids not inproving and running outta strikes so the establishment parts ways with the guy, I tell him he can retrieve his stuff cause he kept a considerable amount of things at work when he returns him the knife but instead he weasels in on my one day off and grabs his shit and keeps the knife… now he works at a factory.

My favorite edge on that knife was to polish the front blade road as much as possible with a green brick then polish the back with a shapton 5k, great gravlox slicer… I wish some kid didn’t steal it.

[XexoX]

Great story. So sad about the knife going with the kid. I'm sure you've got lots more stories to tell. I learned more about the people structure in a professional kitchen from what your wrote than I could ever figure out on my own. Thank you.

[ronnie_suburban]

The story of that knife offers a glimpse into the industry. I’m the third chef of a restaurant, the first chef bought the yanigiba as a gift for the first sous before the restaurant opened; however, shortly before we opened the sous relapsed and went on a meth fueled bender and lost his job before it even started and the gift knife turned into a house knife. When I was a line cook, me and the first chef were the only two who would properly sharpen it while using it and how I treated knives and food is one of the reasons I got bumped up from line cook, to lead line, to sous (third in line at this place) but then Covid happened and restaurant decided to part ways with the original chef… I part ways and take a head chef job to pretty much pull a kitchen nightmare situation to fix a resort restaurant and part ways with a full blown crazy lady and find myself as the number two sous at the original restaurant. While I was gone the now head chef has repeatedly put the single bevel through a work sharp (I accidentally referred to it as a chefs choice earlier) so I chew the chef out for attempting to ruin it, take it home and spend a good 4 hours with a coarse stone to get it to the point of not ruined, and tell the chef to never do that again and yards yadda… flash forward to when I took time off to have my first kid, chef kills the knife again with a work sharp and I refuse to touch the knife ever again cause now I dont have time to do this again. Shortly after my return that chef gets canned for being a hack and I get the executive chef position, I notice one of my line cooks is at least sharpening his own knives and in the stage of buying all the thrift store knives to thin out and modify and all the things so I give him the project of bring this home and fix it up and feel free to use it and learn and on and on… just know this is still the restaurants knife…few months go by and this kids not inproving and running outta strikes so the establishment parts ways with the guy, I tell him he can retrieve his stuff cause he kept a considerable amount of things at work when he returns him the knife but instead he weasels in on my one day off and grabs his shit and keeps the knife… now he works at a factory.

My favorite edge on that knife was to polish the front blade road as much as possible with a green brick then polish the back with a shapton 5k, great gravlox slicer… I wish some kid didn’t steal it.

Sounds like a cursed knife if there ever was one. Maybe you're better off that it slipped out of your orbit.